This is a great guide. But could we please stop with the expat nonsense. People want to move? Unless they are literally on a short term secondment with a job, they are immigrants. Let’s normalise this for everyone.
Who are you, and what are you trying to do here? I don't even consult personally. This list is as objective as I can make it, and in almost all cases is based on direct feedback from people living there. Also, when it comes to Italy, I tend to be extremely conservative (eventually, too much). I am not bound to a specific country, which puts me in a position to strive for objectivity. These are all things that those who have been following me on X for a while know very clearly.
I have no idea what angle you are coming from, nor what you are implying, but this is certainly not the right way to approach someone in the comments of a platform.
The difference between expats and immigrants is largely one of intent. Expats plan to return to their home country, while immigrants plan to stay permanently. In the beginning, we're all newcomers—it's our intentions that determine which label fits. xx
I like this framing. The word expat does still have connotations attached. And that may influence the reception someone receives. However your point about intent is very valid and well taken.
Baloney. It makes zero difference what somebody calls themselves; sometimes I consider myself an Expat, whatever that means, sometimes an immigrant, often a refugee from a dictatorship… But mainly I describe myself as somebody from another country who is very fortunate and very happy to live where I do. But go ahead and split hairs if that's your vibe, but this name nitpicking is just silly.
The difference I see between expat and immigrant is largely one of social class. If you're affluent and have more choices, you call yourself an expat. It's a fallacy that immigrants intend to never leave. They often just can't.
Agreed. Generally western people are expats and brown people or eastern people are immigrants. Kind of wealth based and kind of racist. Agree with your definition personally
Pretty racist of YOU to assume “Americans” / “western people” doesn’t encompass brown or black or Asian people when they make up almost half the country eh? The author never said any race statements
I (US citizen) got to live overseas as an older child and teen (Australia — in the Outback, most of that time, and in Brussels). So I have prior experience of being an expat. And what it meant to integrate (or not) into the local community. And the two words do have nuanced meanings — as well as problematic ones.
We always knew we were coming back to the US. But after 40% (then) of my life outside the US, I got to come back as someone who knew the language, but was culturally displaced. That might well not be as true today — the internet changed a lot. But we never chose to live in the American ‘ghettos’. We made friends and lived in the community. In Brussels we frequently played volleyball with our Walloon neighbors. We chose not to live in the bubble of expats. I became relatively fluent in French, enough to travel using it (and be snubbed as much for my Brussels accent as my American one, especially in Paris), and dream in it. But we were expats. We were Yanks abroad who were coming home someday.
Now my wife and I are planning to immigrate (almost certainly to Portugal). And that means the mindset is different. Not that we couldn’t choose to return (*very* unlikely). Being an immigrant is different from being an expat. You intend to stay, and you intend to integrate. You’re not a visitor.
And yes, there are folks who misuse “expat,” but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t have a meaning distinct from “immigrant.” (Nor that some of the folks misusing it are racists.)
I agree but not all white people were colonisers. Some were indeed colonised. Let’s respect nuances also. My point is, let’s simplify the language. Those who migrate are e/im-migrants. And migration has benefits so I am not suggesting all migration should stop.
The quality of life in much of Europe is higher than the US - a move there is often not romantic but realistic. Unless you just love cheese from a spray can, military dominance, wrestling, and canyons. Which might explain why you are tired with reading about it so often.
Maybe stop with the stereotypes too. Nothing in your last sentence describes where I live in NJ, 15 miles from Manhattan. Sometimes it helps to remember that the US is as large and as populous, and therefore, different, as all of Western Europe.
That's true Mike, but it's also true that no matter where you go in the US, you're stewing in a fetid soup of toxic selfishness and a wildly inflated sense of entitlement. It's baked into American culture. Selfishness is the main reason I left. Portugal is a breath of fresh air - the default here is what's good for everybody first and foremost.
I understand where you are coming from and I don't disagree with what I think your underlying message is.
However, I'm an American retiree in Lisbon. If we're going to be brutally honest, "expat" is a more accurate description of most of my compatriots here (I'm speaking specifically about retired people) because even if you intend to stay long term or permanently it's somewhere between difficult to impossible to truly integrate as much as you might want to. Plus, many of us (by no means all) are in an economically relatively privileged position and could go back to the US tomorrow if we wanted to. And, most retirees here who can afford to spend every second they are allowed to be outside of Portugal traveling outside the country (true of me and my spouse). Most retirees don't learn enough Portuguese to have a meaningful conversation in the language, and socialize primarily with other foreigners. There are some Portuguese people who choose to be part of primarily immigrant/expat networks that I'm part of or aware of but any associated activities happen in English.
I've been in LIsbon just short of five years and speak B2 Portuguese. In this entire time there are a grand total of three Portuguese people I've ever had a social encounter with in Portuguese and only one of those is currently in the picture. (This is nothing about Portuguese people, it's just the reality of moving to a different country as a retiree). By contrast I could be doing some kind of social activity every day with Americans here if I wanted to.
I'd love to find a way to integrate more into Portugual but honestly I have no idea how to do that. And, I and many other Americans are starting to feel a little less welcome here with recent changes in nationality laws. I'm open to possibilities but for now I'm happy enough living mostly in my American bubble with some rare forays outside of it.
I guess anyone who reads this for themselves can decide whether I'm really an immigrant or an expat. To the extent I think of myself as an expat it's less that I'm trying to distance myself from some negative image of "immigrants" and more an acknowledgement of the incredible privilege I have as an American relative to people who come here to escape poverty in Africa and South Asia.
Thank you for the honesty. Indeed, any move is not easy. Even within a country one is familiar with. You describe the challenges well. Integrating into a new society takes a lot of continuous effort and often some luck to hit on the right entry point. I still hold that the word expat has associations and connotations that many may not be totally aware of. Good wishes for your continued efforts at integration.
Thanks. I would agree that the word expat has associations and connotations and would probably agree with you about what those are. And I think all of them probably apply to at least some retired people from other places in Europe.
One other thing I would say is that while there may be some limits to how much I can integrate here (some due to things about me, some due to cultural difference and coming at an older age), I do try to integrate in spirit as much as possible. First by learning the language to the best of my ability, reading Portuguese books, magazines and newspapers, listeining to Portuguese music, learning about the history of the country, keeping up with current events. following a Portuguese football team, rooting for the national team in the World Cup. I feel like doing that enhances my experience of living here.
Thanks Ken for your post. I understand your experiences , but as a semi expat and retiree, flipping between NYC and Barcelona, all the friends I have in the latter city are Spaniards. Yes, they do speak english which makes things easier. Like yourself I speak B2 Spanish and now B1 Catalan. Both are very helpful in day to day experiences.
Most friends I have made are (not so many ) thru language exchanges and meetups, despite being a senior and my friends being at least 10 years younger.
Still, as a single person it can be lonely at times. But I love Barcelona and the Spanish culture.
My biggest concern, though not a problem yet, has been the Spanish tax authorities. I make sure to never spend 183 days, and become tax resident, tho I am a Spanish citizen. I have accessed the health care system and paid out of pocket at emergency rooms, but get 80% remimbursement with my secondary medical plan in the US. "
I look at the experience as a late in life journey and make the best of it.
I love how you and I agree and I get lambasted (ripped to shreds while being personally insulted) by OP while you are praised foro saying virtually the same thing. Wow. The cognitive dissonance on this thread is wild.
As a European, I have to say I really enjoy being on this continent. But life is life. People who make a (semi) permanent move are emigrants / immigrants. No issue with that but please,integrate; you are in someone else’s country for a while. Not an expat, an immigrant.
You clearly do have an issue with it. You are telling an entire large group of people who move to “your continent” how to act and behave as if learning another language or another lifestyle is easy *snaps fingers*. Why don’t you have a little grace and let people do what works best for them in their own time? WHY DO YOU CARE?
Also “why do you care” was my question but in typical online fashion you don’t answer the question. You turn it around on me as if my disagreement with you is the problem. Open your mind
I did answer that. I have pointed out multiple times that the term expat holds connotations, that Americans often don’t seem to understand that and then register (aurally or subconsciously) a shift in people’s attitudes towards them and may be confused by that shift which then plays out as locals being ‘rude’ etc etc. The issue is not what the word means per the dictionary, it is the assumptions and connotations it holds. But really, if you have not understood that in this entire thread, I am not sure what else I can say which would be useful.
I would argue that you don’t want to hear an accurate depiction of what the words mean. I don’t care what people say …. you do. You’re the one who started this whole conversation by saying what terminology we should use or not use - “can we stop using the term expat” “it means the same thing as immigrant” (it doesn’t) and then you try to (now) place the blame on “many people are saying”. How about you just let people call themselves what they are comfortable with and stop dictating what “other people say”? I’ve finished my point.
With all the due respect, this is as reliable as any Forbes ‘best of’ list.
AI generated cliches to please the eye and name dropping to please the algorithm.
It’s fine if the purpose (as it is) is to sell relocation advice, but - at least when it comes to Italy - it’s far from the reality. Starting from the data.
7% scheme is not working. In the past a few hundreds used it, a total fiscal policy failure and don’t expect it is automatically granted.
One euro houses - you are right here.
The ‘Ostuni’ bit… have you actually been to Ostuni?
Please don’t confuse the postcard with real Italy.
Who are you, and what are you trying to do here? I don't even consult personally. This list is as objective as I can make it, and in almost all cases is based on direct feedback from people living there. Also, when it comes to Italy, I tend to be extremely conservative (eventually, too much). I am not bound to a specific country, which puts me in a position to strive for objectivity. These are all things that those who have been following me on X for a while know very clearly.
I have no idea what angle you are coming from, nor what you are implying, but this is certainly not the right way to approach someone in the comments of a platform.
Your article is AI generated and it is boring to read a machine made text, you didn’t even edit out the LLM cliches. Your comment, though, is genuine. In your reply to ITS Italy you showed your human side! I sensed anger, frustration, and even a bit of shame. Now, I see the face of the author. Your AI written article, on the other hand, is a machine text. I can ask chatgpt to compile this list. The fact that you have friends in these places does not negate the use of LLM.
Nonsense. PC bullshit. This is the simplistic definition creep of our era, where many nuances are now siloed into single categories. Everything is racist, for example, which is all over these comments. I've traveled for decades and nobody I've ever met said "I'm an immigrant."
OFFS. Stop already with the goofy hair splitting. I live in Europe and I don't give a damn what people call me; ex Pat, immigrant, refugee… Sometimes I'm one sometimes I'm the other. I just consider myself a person who was very fortunate to live where I do. Grow up.
The word ex pat comes from “expatriate”. It’s an ACTUAL word in English. So maybe look it up and see that it doesn’t mean the same thing as immigrant which means to immigrate somewhere. Why do you care what we call ourselves ? I can very easily be both and have it not be offensive to anyone - except you I guess. As an American not living in America my home country I’m an ex pat. As an American living in Portugal now I’m an immigrant. You want to define me but why does it matter? You’re putting a race, class or socio-economic meaning on the terms, not me.
Actually in many countries, the term expat (as opposed to any other term used to describe people who move country) holds very specific connotations. That is what people are trying to tell Americans. If Americans don’t want to hear that, then they cannot also be surprised when there is an instinctive response to the use of this word. I am not here to create a polemic around this. Just politely trying to flag that the term expat has connotations.
Wow. Just wow. You're the kind of American I moved here to get away from. I don't know where you live, but I hope it's a very long way from where I live.
I would be beyond thrilled to not run into another old white dude who thinks he paved the way to immigrating (see what I did there?) in Europe. Feel free to avoid Lisbon and the surrounding areas and we’ll be fine Old man.
No it popped+up here for sone season when I was trying to respond to another nasty piece of work by Noel Keith who seems to have it in for so called Boomers who are in his opinion very wealthy and causing him to be poor….lol For some reason it jumped out if that part of the thread and ended up here and I couldn’t change it or move it to where I meant it was meant to go so sorry about that. I agree with your posts really.
I have lived outside of the USA for over 30 years and even became a citizen of one of the European countries mentioned, but I will still, upon occasion, use both words, immigrant and expat, to describe my milieu and others who live in it with me. The article made it clear there is no “one size fits all”. Thanks for all of the helpful information.
So glad that all the boomers who retired rich off of a dysfunctional and highly leveraged housing market so they can go and enjoy socialized medicine, walkable cities, investments in education and clean energy.
Ya know, all the things they voted against for the last 50-60 years.
Unfortunately, most boomers don't fall in that category. Thru worked hard expecting a retirement that looked quite different from what they got. The wealthy always do well.
I have lots of stats for you to misconstrue and argue with, boomer, but I’m not going to bother because your demented self cannot even use grammar at this point.
You sound like a trump voter: resentful and entitled. I don’t appreciate being lumped into some fantasy you use to justify failing to meet your own expectations. I’m not “house rich,” don’t own a home, worked my ASS off as a single parent so that I could afford to pay my bills when I retired. I’m by no means wealthy; I’m solvent. I never lived beyond my means - which meant living in a cheap one bedroom apartment until my daughter was 8 years old. I’m a democrat. I’ve never once voted to destroy the earth, the climate or my neighbors’ health and well being. So STFU.
Thank you. Noel Keith doesn't seem to understand that most boomers got screwed like those who followed. Every generation has the wealthy that do just fine. And I do believe GenZ is getting the worst of it with even less opportunity, but it's just as ignorant to blame a generation for all the ills of this nation as it is to blame immigrants. Look up. It's the tech bros and other oligarchs.
Well, if all boomers are wealthy, all Gen X must be wealthy like Musk. Right? Because yes, the middle class worked our butts off then pulled up the ladder to make sure our kids got screwed. Make sense of that. Blame boomers if it makes you feel good, but if you want change, you need to figure out who is screwing us all to the wall. If you prefer whining, have at it.
Baby Boomers hold the majority of U.S. household wealth at over 51% (more than $85 trillion), despite comprising only about a fifth of the population. Generation X holds approximately 26%, while Millennials and Gen Z account for around 11%
Your generation has been in charge of damn near everything public, nonprofit, and private since ‘92 AND LOOK WHERE WE ARE NOW.
Baby Boomers hold the majority of U.S. household wealth at over 51% (more than $85 trillion), despite comprising only about a fifth of the population. Generation X holds approximately 26%, while Millennials and Gen Z account for around 11%
Your generation has been in charge of damn near everything public, nonprofit, and private since ‘92 AND LOOK WHERE WE ARE NOW.
Musk has more wealth than almost 50% of the world. I guess if boomers are responsible for everything from adulthood till today, you see us as homogeneous. But like Gen X, the wealth of their generation and those that followed is held by a small group of individuals known as the tech bros. That's how life is. So, instead of victim blaming, because we are all victims of the oligarchs, I've just been victimized longer, we should be clear on where the blame belongs because it's going to take all of us to make real change. I have children. I want a better life for them.
You are completely changing your position with this comment. Also, do you know what a straw person is? Plus bringing Musk up at all is a red herring.
Are you fundamentally dishonest or just demented?
You sound like a MAGA incel screeching about “nOt aLL mEn” when I give you facts that contradict the earlier position that you took directly out of your exhaust pipe.
You keep saying you’re a disabled guy. What’s your disability? Were you born with? Is it due to a work injury? Are you a disabled veteran? Just curious…
Nope, I come with facts. No where have I said that I hate an entire generation. I do want you to own the reality of it but that’s all. Besides, an ad hominem is what you’re gonna open up with? That literally means you’re a fool with nothing to say.
Your generation voted to pull the ladder up behind them for 50 years.
Your generation has 1/5 of the population but also over 1/2 of the wealth. And you had more wealth at their age than X and Millennials do now. Also you’ve been in charge of almost everything public/private/nonprofit since ‘92 and look where we are.
I hope you don’t live anywhere but the US and thereby inflict your rather Trump sounding opinions on others. Don’t try and label me as a boomer from the US because I am a boomer from somewhere else. I doubt I’d waste my time talking to you if I ever had the misfortune to cross paths with you as you seem to have a large resentful chip on your shoulder.
I am physically disabled and I use my real name and face on here. I have been writing quality content in service of the resistance since Jan ‘25. I have been physically assaulted for gathering signatures and still I keep getting out here in Arkkkansas to protest and to knock on doors.
Boomers have been in charge of everything almost public, private, and nonprofit since ‘92 and look where we are. You have over half the wealth with only 1/5 of the population. You voted Trump more than any other generation.
And yet here you are with this stupid purity testing. Total covert Narcissist territory.
You seem to believe that being disabled is a license to abuse other people. Mistreatment of others is probably the least intelligent way to go through life. Treating others ethically is not only the right thing to do, it is the smart thing to do. You have zero knowledge of the people who you attack yet are so angry with them. Life can be difficult for many different reasons and playing the victim doesn't help anyone, you least of all. If you don't have a therapist one is definitely a good idea. I have a mentally ill daughter who came to me when she was six. She is abusive like you are and like you, she too often feels isolated and afraid. Angry people don't bother me other than the sadness felt from watching another human being actively self destucting. Noel, Think about it logically. If you spew insults at people for aging how is it just for you to whine over lack of kindness for being disabled? It isn't, if you try to stop being a person who makes the world an uglier place, you will feel less miserable from day to day.No one here caused your mental illness,your disability, your poverty, or your fear disguised as anger. BTW your boomer facts are skewed. Many of the obscenely wealthy people happen to be boomers. Many of us live without financial security. Using statistics without context can confuse someone into belief outside of the reality that we live in. You are angry with the wrong group of people. Have you ever asked yourself how finding things to feel angry about improves your existence? I have the answer for you, it doesn't.
This article hits home for me as a boomer. We’ve been brainwashed since birth and most of us, rich and poor, are still living in the world of American exceptionalism. To my fellow generation, we all need to wake up from our narcissistic bubble before we die. Stop watching CNN, Fox News, etc etc and start thinking critically about the country as it’s become. We have been voting for this mess for 50 years. And stop being scared of socialism.
Dude! If you’re living in a narcissistic fantasy of “American exceptionalism” that’s on you. Don’t lump me in with your bullshit. I’m a “late boomer” (😉) and have no illusions about what our country is and ALWAYS HAS BEEN. We started out racist and intolerant. We had one little bubble of tolerance and brotherly love. When we elected Barack Obama we fell victim to the idea that maybe things would be different and better from now on. Trump’s election disabused us of that folly. The only surprise for me was just how many Americans are dumb as a box of rocks.
Congratulations! Enjoy your mea culpa.
And fyi - all those corporations that destroyed the planet and our standard of living were run by republicans (for the most part). That has more to do with where we’re at than age.
I am not here to argue with you. I am genuinely curious what you get from going online to spend time interacting with people without civility, using tactics better suited to the kindergarten playground, and insulting the people who you respond to?
Do you have an extremely unhappy life and need to vent rage? Do you not like yourself and take out the feeling on strangers? I am sincerely asking what is the reward you receive from going online to be unpleasant to those who you encounter?
I find the lack of emotional regulation to the point of insults and name calling to be destructive (as do many people from varying fields who have decades of knowledge) and humiliating for people who are adults.
Civil debate is an exchange of ideas that is often useful in providing solutions.
Squabbling is useless and is only noise. There is nothing productive in it.
You are hilarious. Your insults are of course not applicable because you have no knowledge of the people who you insult.
It is actually worse than my trolling you. I never gave you a thought at all, lol.
You remind me of the unhappy little boys on the playground who run around being mean to smaller kids and in imagination believe they are seen as strong and tough, by other people.
I was curious to know if you actually get something out of it?
If you are too shy to respond, lol, no worries. I chose to ask you because you figuratively run around being mean to so many people it makes you easy to locate, lol.
I can use grammar, and I'd challenge you to any stats you want to put up. But you won't, because that would require you to do some actual homework, which I strongly suspect you are incapable of or unwilling to do to support you sweeping generalizations of people you don't know.
Nope, I come with facts. No where have I said that I hate an entire generation. I do want you to own the reality of it but that’s all. Besides, an ad hominem is what you’re gonna open up with? That literally means you’re a fool with nothing to say.
Your generation voted to pull the ladder up behind them for 50 years.
Your generation has 1/5 of the population but also over 1/2 of the wealth. And you had more wealth at their age than X and Millennials do now. Also you’ve been in charge of almost everything public/private/nonprofit since ‘92 and look where we are.
This comment was about the entire generation. How come every triggered old fart responds with ‘me’ and ‘I’?
Nope, I come with facts. No where have I said that I hate an entire generation. I do want you to own the reality of it but that’s all. Besides, an ad hominem is what you’re gonna open up with? That literally means you’re a fool with nothing to say.
Your generation voted to pull the ladder up behind them for 50 years.
Your generation has 1/5 of the population but also over 1/2 of the wealth. And you had more wealth at their age than X and Millennials do now. Also you’ve been in charge of almost everything public/private/nonprofit since ‘92 and look where we are.
This comment was about the entire generation. How come every triggered old fart responds with ‘me’ and ‘I’?
I was a pharmacist working 2 jobs and too busy to take the time to invest properly. But your point is well taken. Every time HVAC is out, I get sticker shock that makes me regret every choice I've made in life. And, blah, blah, blah.
You seem to lump pretty much everybody here together regardless of what they say. So who's the liar Noel? You're a bitter, petty, small, hateful, pathetic person. Enjoy the rest of your bitter, hateful, pathetic life.
Aww it’s so precious that you used a 90’s term with interwebs. I got another 90’s term for ya: DUH!
Baby Boomers hold the majority of U.S. household wealth at over 51% (more than $85 trillion), despite comprising only about a fifth of the population. Generation X holds approximately 26%, while Millennials and Gen Z account for around 11%
Your generation has been in charge of damn near everything public, nonprofit, and private since ‘92 AND LOOK WHERE WE ARE NOW.
We also often worked 70 to 90 hours per week. I did and spent all the money raising kids who were alone in the world and have very little now. When you generalize you are fundamentally inaccurate overall.
Trisha, Trisha, Trisha. LOL you make me laugh. My ex wife and I BOTH worked. We are far from wealthy. Have you gone into a grocery store, or a Target or elsewhere and never seen boomers in there working?
I would have a bit of respect for you if your claim was somrwhat nuanced. Not every boomer has, like, 4 houses and 2 Ferraris. Sweetie pie, get a clue. Sorry baby girl, if you don't like it, take a look in the mirror.
Insults and name calling only serve to make people look as if they have nothing intelligent to add to a debate. If you allow excessive emotion to make you do that people feel justified in ignoring you. I didn't like how the man belittled you. From the outside looking in he came out seeming to be the more intelligent in spite of his lack of kindness. Please try to calm down. Anger hurts you more than anyone else in the end.
You’re swooping in to pull statistics out of your ass, huh?
And on top of that it’s an irrelevant claim as well. Too bad this conversation is about boomers who made out and pulled up the ladder after them who are JUST NOW retiring to move over there.
It was you who swooped in to shit in this article. As far as relevence, by your logic we could blame the Jews for voting in the Nazis-they were present, they were of the correct age-it must be their fault. Swoop away now.
Presenting a logical analagy is completely legit. Do you blame German Jews for Hitler? You are claiming that all members a group should be blamed for the acts of some. That's the definition of predudice. What group are you, Keith? Is your group able to vote? Did any of them vote for Trump?
Who said we can't accept anything Noel? Nowhere here has anyone said they don't accept that our generation has been in charge, and pretty much everybody can see where we are. So once again, you're lumping everybody (that you don't know anything about) into one big category and making baseless, sweeping accusations with absolutely no facts whatsoever.
Trisha- full disclosure . I am a boomer and clearly see the plight adults under 40 face in this economy/society . And the wealth disparity is obvious as well. But i would note there were times when the economy was underwater and jobs were scare as well (~1980). The sequence risk of when you graduated from college was palpable, however, things always seemed to turn around in less than five years or so and we could afford rents esp with roommates. But the game HAS been rigged to favor those with assets *(ie own their homes and ‘stonks”) and COSTS have risen so dramatically , and the bottom has fallen out in our education system. Of course if you graduate these days from UC Berkeley with a French lit degree good luck finding a decent job, That said, it doenst all fall on greedy boomers. Even re our politics . There were plenty of young people who voted for Trump -TWICE!- and globalization has lifted hundreds of millions of Chinese and third world humans out of poverty, but it has meant inflation in US and forced many women reluctantly into the full time work force. But all of Americans need to spend less time on intergenerational hating and looking for solution. As you note, boomers have skin back in the game now with their grandchildren. We need to truly reform and truly financially support universal k-12 education, day care and put all kids on Medicaid until they are 22, and end the disparity between taxes on capital and income, and allow student debt to be treated like any other form of debt. What we DONT need is more unprepared and disinterested kids wasting 4 years taking obviously unemployable majors, federal support that simply raises the cost of Tuition and housing. mortgages. What we need is 1)a great k-12 eduction for all kids, but this will require half the country agreeing to 100k plus teachers salaries and national standards, and the other half to require teachers major in their disciplines rather than attend “teachers” colleges and submit to they themselves being graded; 2) provide at least as good health care for children as we do for the elderly and end this crazy paradox where grandma gets admitted to Mass General with walking pneumonia and her grandchildren cant afford to go to the ER in a diabetic crisis.
The truth is the Socialized medicine is bad. You wait years and the doctors don’t care. Unless you see and pay them in their private practice.
Walkable cities, no not really. Immigrants from third world countries have made most of these cities and Europe in general unsafe to walk. Rapes have climbed through the roof. These primitive cultures are not punished for their crimes and are thus emboldened to commit more. Especially against women, children, and the elderly.
Clean energy?! Are you kidding?!
Solar is a scam. Solar and wind are completely UNRELIABLE which leads to its having extremely expensive or having absolutely 0 electricity when you need it most such as extreme heat or freezing weather.
I’m looking at you Spain, Portugal, Germany and France.
Or how about Germany shutting down it’s nuclear plants so it can burn the dirtiest coal imaginable, buy fuel from Russia, and completely de industrialize it’s manufacturing sector?
The end result more pollution, more poverty, and a government that fails to correct.
China sold the world Solar and wind while they built thousands of coal burning plants, roughly two a week or the past three years, at least! We all breathe the same air.
No one in the world owns more coal burning plants then China.
Yet interestingly, no one demonizes China for utilizing Coal more than any other country in the world ?!
Strange that, hmmmm.
China is not stupid enough to fall for solar and wind( though they hold the monopoly on rare earth minerals and slave labor/in the mining sector)
China depends on Coal, and dictatorships for their oil.
So no, Europe has zero Dependable Energy. You have been reading too many headlines. Do your own research and try for some long term critical thinking.
Europe will be in a world of hurt this winter and it’s looking to intimidate and censor it’s citizens as aggressively as possible now.
If you are not happy in the US you are not only ungrateful but exceedingly ignorant of what is happening in Europe, Africa, and the East. Because this is just a drop in the bucket.
I'm living in France and own my first home. I am retired. I am very aware of my good fortunes, however. I was able to have a good career that I loved with a decent steady income. The career also came with a very good final salary pension. Good jobs with longevity existed when i started. Now it is harder to find these kinds of jobs plus almost no pensions are based on final (generally highest) salaries.
I was able to save money and started investing early. Why? Because the cost of living was not as high and I didn't have children. Life, therefore, was not as expensive but perhaps not as fulfilling as having children would have allowed.
I learned financial.planning at home and at school. Debt was severely frowned upon but as noted one could live without needing credit...or very much.
My education (3 degrees to PhD level plus one associate degree) was very inexpensive. I was able to leave education with no debt.
The current environment has few of the benefits I was afforded and I am aware of my good fortune. I am not rich but I can live without financial worry.
That we could improve the systems for young people so they to could live with fewer worries.
I hear you and thank you for your thoughtful comment.
I do worry (assuming that you are an American expatriate) that you cannot affect change as easily from there without presence at protests, organizing, or volunteership; plus MAGA is likely going to continue to assail voting by mail.
Stop being an ageist. Most boomers aren’t wealthy and are living on social security. We worked for 50 years. You have white male entitlement, which goes along with the self pity party
I'd invite you not to lump all boomers (which I barely qualify as) into one group, so as not to make yourself sound like such an ignoramus. I'm about as far left a Liberal as they come in the US (barely center left by European standards). I worked hard for my retirement, and I sacrificed a lot to get where I am. I'm far from rich, but by Portuguese standards I'm pretty well off. But I don't flash that around. And for the record, I have private health insurance here, and I've never used the public system for anything but prescriptions (where you have no choice). That kind of attitude toward others you don't know is a big reason I left the US.
Why can’t we have a conversation about the generation as a whole without dusty old farts like you getting offended?
Why can’t any of you open with something other than Ad Hominem and triggered babbling. This is not about you personally, dumbass. Save your pathetic life story for someone who cares.
Who said I'm offended Noel? Quote where I said that. If you're curious who's triggered here, go back and read every single one of your posts in this thread out loud to yourself, looking in the mirror. Then get back to us about who's triggered.
By not having grown past name calling you limit your ability to interest other people into feeling anything but wanting you to go away. My dad taught me when I was three that when you begin to insult people and deteriorate into name calling other people feel justified in not giving any credence to what you communicate. You don't write like someone who has been well educated. You behave in a way that is similar to Trump's behavior. This is why you are mistaken for a Trump supporter. You waste time and energy on attacking and blaming. Attacking and blaming are Trump's signature methods of communication. Do you really not see the similarities?
Nope, I come with facts. No where have I said that I hate an entire generation. I do want you to own the reality of it but that’s all. Besides, an ad hominem is what you’re gonna open up with? That literally means you’re a fool with nothing to say.
Your generation voted to pull the ladder up behind them for 50 years.
Your generation has 1/5 of the population but also over 1/2 of the wealth. And you had more wealth at their age than X and Millennials do now. Also you’ve been in charge of almost everything public/private/nonprofit since ‘92 and look where we are.
This comment was about the entire generation. How come every triggered old fart responds with ‘me’ and ‘I’?
Noel, it’s unsurprising older generations have more wealth than younger generations. What is new/surprising is the lack of opportunity for similar age cohorts and recognition millenials /genz may NOT have same wealth boomers did, BUT nb there is a huge wealth transfer just starting to take shape between boomers and their kids-where things will get grim is when millenials and younger find THEY cant help our help kids or transfer a lot of accumulated wealth. Im less worried that Elon musk is a trillion wire per se (though there are a host of baleful second order effects -DOGE, antitrust, SCE violations etc) than i am my grandchildren wont have a stock portfolio/assets of meaningful or their children will have to attend private school to get a good education. The “american equation “ doenst pencil ou any longer, and yes the boomers got theirs, but thats as much a function of globalization , poor policy, huge immigration inflows with out commensurate cultural integration, eroding social and political cohesion , and technological progress as it is boomer avarice.
And why is that? Did you go back to school to start a completely new career from scratch at 42 like I did? I can't help that you're struggling, but being bitter at the success of others just makes you a very small person.
I’m published in Epidemiology, hold degrees in Math & Economics, and have federal statistics certifications. Who the fuck are you to say I’m illiterate?
You opened with fundamental dishonesty and we’re not gonna talk about anything else until you admit it.
Who said you're illiterate, Noel? Quote where anybody said that. I'm more than happy for you not to talk about anything else. Ever. At all. With anybody. You're pathetic.
Trisha- full disclosure . I am a boomer and clearly see the plight adults under 40 face in this economy/society . And the wealth disparity is obvious as well. But i would note there were times when the economy was underwater and jobs were scare as well (~1980). The sequence risk of when you graduated from college was palpable, however, things always seemed to turn around in less than five years or so and we could afford rents esp with roommates. But the game HAS been rigged to favor those with assets *(ie own their homes and ‘stonks”) and COSTS have risen so dramatically , and the bottom has fallen out in our education system. Of course if you garage these days from UC Berkeley with a French lit degree good luck finding a decent job, That said, it doenst all fall on greedy boomers. Even re our politics . There were plenty of young people who voted for Trump -TWICE!- and globalization has lifted hundreds of millions of Chinese and third world humans out of poverty, but it has meant inflation in US and forced many women reluctantly into the full time work force. But all of Americans need to spend less time on intergenerational hating and looking for solution. As you note, boomers have skin back in the game now with their grandchildren. We need to truly reform and truly financially support universal k-12 education, day care and put all kids on Medicaid until they are 22, and end the disparity between taxes on capital and income, and allow student debt to be treated like any other form of debt. What we DONT need is more unprepared and disinterested kids wasting 4 years taking obviously unemployable majors, federal support that simply raises the cost of Tuition and housing. mortgages. What we need is 1)a great k-12 eduction for all kids, but this will require half the country agreeing to 100k plus teachers salaries and national standards, and the other half to require teachers major in their disciplines rather than attend “teachers” colleges and submit to they themselves being graded; 2) provide at least as good health care for children as we do for the elderly and end this crazy paradox where grandma gets admitted to Mass General with walking pneumonia and her grandchildren cant afford to go to the ER in a diabetic crisis.
There’s also a lot to be said for unions being at a 100 year low in membership mostly due right to work laws that proliferated since the 80’s. As soon as that happened, wages stopped going up with profits (as they had been rising together since WWII)
And that’s not just economics, union meetings are many folks’ introduction to politics and they can very much see for themselves that the rich are not their friends.
I appreciate your balanced comment and the education and healthcare notions are indeed important.
That said, I have no sympathy for the early 80’s recession when millennials have been dealing with recessions half the time since ‘03.
Millennials are poorest living generation while being the most educated. And no, it’s not because of college majors that you don’t approve of. We did what we were supposed to but as a group the boomers voted to pull the ladder up behind them.
And yeah, there were some Gen X, Z and millennials who voted for Trump but millennials voted for Democrats the most and Boomers voted for Trump the most. So I am not sure why you brought that up.
Thanks for the response and be well in this unholy year ✌️
Noel - 1.no question that to work and union declines are a factor, but im also struck by how expensive non union wages are (albeit necessary to survive in this economy) 2. I should have been clearer on recessions during boomer launch years- we were never hit with cyclical issues like younger generations, even if the sequencing risk was apparent then. Major difference is we had confidence things would turn around and they did. Younger generations lack that conviction and they are arguably correct. 3. Boomers could be indifferent about their major and get jobs, and I vividly recall getting a 2% college loan that didn’t start until AFTER i got my graduate degree -I cried the day i had to pay it off at age 35 ! And yes there was an industry that encouraged kids to go to college who clearly had no interest or yes-ability-to succeed academically In college. And yes we did pull rug out by changing rules to make educational loans non dischargeable i bankruptcy . But we’ve known for some time too many kids are attending colleges that have little impact on their wage futures. Bt it’s already been demonstrated government cant/wont absorb these debts yet so many people are hobbled by what $200,000 i educational debt ? (NOBODY of any age or political party suggested thsi was prudent) We need a little more honesty and grace from all generations on this to find a solution that balances both valid perspective intergenerationally 4. I brought u the trump vote because older people routinely vote republican-2024 brought no surprises there. The shock was younger generations voting republican far more the in the past, ostensibly enough t to make the difference. Younger generations , despite the penchant for boomers to back low tax candidates, had it within the power to elect Hilary. THey failed to turn out for her as they did with obama or even biden. I would only suggest that getting your generation organized -especially females - is going to be far more catalytic than railing against boomers for the reasons you suggest . We are looking at low turnout elections decided by what 60,000 voters in swing districts in .suburbabn Atlanta, Philadelphia, phoenix, Detroit etc for the foreseeable future.
Final point you make some very important points and your frustration is justified. But you should consider if you Palpable anger and intemperate language is advancing your politics. It’s really over the top and a turn off. Be smart and be effective.
1. I never used the word hate or indicated it was “all on us” or the sole cause - (who is putting words into whose mouth ? You seem draw inferences from my comments that are not correct. I as suggesting , stipulating younger generations are victimized in thsi regard, that they had agency but failed to exercise in recent elections, that doesn’t exculpate te :dinosaurs” who voted for MAGA, trump etc, but should be borne in mind in critical 2028 general election -in 2 of the last three elections dems have nominated arguably the ONLY person who could have lost to trump -you, I , WE cant affor to make that mistake again. I fear the anger you and other posters express is gogin to result in a nominee that feels good but unelectable re electoral college will hand the Supreme Court over to radical Christian corporate billionaire country club
2. The health analogy is apt. I am an MD and MPH specializing in emergency and internal medicine , so I have standing and experience. Both anecdotes are true and personal i my extended family. Yes you can go to an ED and be triaged for life threatening condition, but once stabilized you may not be admitted and you certainly will receive a bill, and that bill , unpaid will go to collection and ruin your credit.
3. My wife has a career, my 2 daughters do, and all my nieces do.Im hardly a troglodyte . My point was many many women would prefer to not HAVE to work for financial reasons, yet today most have to. That’s a huge change and with day care costs today it bArely moves the needle for family finances. One income use used be enough
4. Separating globalization from capitalism and corporate profit maximization is bizarre. THey are inextricably linked.
To be fair to Harris on 1, if Harris had been the nominee (like if Biden had intentionally been a one term president) from the beginning it would have been quite helpful.
Hard to say if it would have made the difference electorally, of course.
Even in the Netherlands it's worth learning Dutch. The main difference is you'll have to be at a much higher level before people stop switching to English with you, and you might have to ask them. But it's just as much a key to being part of things in Rotterdam as in Rome
As European I wonder why there must be s city that fits Americans. The immigrant is the one who should adapt, not the other way round. Our lifestyle and culture are different from country to country, and from city to city, built over thousands of years,there's no need for Americans to "fix" it. I heard so many Americans living here and complaining about Europe, about taxes, about people.... it's boring. Nobody asked them to move here.
I'm frankly astounded by the number of comments in this direction, because I can hardly find an angle in my article that expresses the concept you're pointing out.
Why, indeed, should a European city exist to suit Americans? And conversely, why would Americans even want that, when the whole point for them is precisely to choose a different lifestyle? I can't find the logic in it either way.
My point is to highlight places, often not so well known, that tend to make Americans happy, and to share anecdotes and stories, or more often mistakes they've made in the past, so as to help improve the experience.
In writing this, I noted how often an American's mistake is to assume "they don't know how to run business X in region Y, so let me launch a company." That would actually be a net positive for the local economy if it worked. The fact is that it rarely does, and I warned them about that.
On your last point, that you've heard Americans complaining about Europe while living in Europe, I have nothing to add. All the Americans I know love Europe. Otherwise they'd leave, as some occasionally do, and move back.
You're absolutely correct. Foreign languages can be a challenge for older people. We live in Portugal but fortunately I learned my Portuguese many years earlier when I had lived in Brazil.
This occurs within the USA. Oregon is still the best place I have ever lived. When many of the people from S California moved to Oregon to escape the negatives in the culture of S CA, they worked to bring those very negatives into the culture here. The actions taken by groups of people from S CA have removed many of the positives we had in Oregon. A large number of Americans complain about entitlement while bulldozing the areas that they enter with massive amounts of entitlement of their own.
I joke that we don't need to worry about AI becoming self aware. It will be impossible to find a human being to influence that type of thinking in AI.
My takeaway was - Are these the fellow expatigrants that I would have to socialize with if I moved overseas?
One of the the things I appreciate about Europeans is that they are generally more polite than Americans. At least in my experience. But the people on this thread are less civilized than my US neighbors.
Excellent article Alejandro. I appreciate that you highlight the social and the financial implications in each city you mention.
Good information. But this American picked Canada. Country-wide 30% discount on everything from a US income perspective. Good tax treaty. Culturally is nearly like being in the US; and I can drive home if I wanted to.
The downsides are the weather, which is terrible if you don’t like the cold in winter, housing and many purchases can be very expensive, but the 30% discount helps a lot.
The way things work will make sense to you; also, you won’t get home sick and can always visit Europe.
This is one of the best, no-fluff articles I've read on this subject. Thank you. I like how you bring up the downsides too, though a full treatment of wealth tax and the fact that Roths are a nightmare in countries like NL and ES could be an entire future article for you.
Two cities you didn't mention in this list: Tours (France) and Coimbra (Portugal). I haven't been to Tours but have been to Coimbra twice briefly and it seems like a pleasant university town. Thoughts about those?
Thanks a lot, much appreciated! I know Coimbra well enough to say that it can be a good pick, it's a university city. I don't know any non-Portuguese person, however, who lives there. But it's a lovely city, dense with history!
I have an Italian friend from Naples who did her doctorate at Coimbra university, then ended up relocating there. I've been there twice: it's a hidden gem: way more chill that even Porto but I don't know how well someone would fare there if they don't make an effort to learn Portuguese. I'm partial to university towns which is why I'm intrigued about Tours.
Swedish culture and unwritten rules can trip you up, you are constantly being judged (like Germany, but friendlier, though there are plenty of conformist cultures - England, Japan - where people are allowed to “let loose” under certain conditions), lots of things are expensive and winter is dark.
Fantastic during the summer months and the people are good fun.
A fascinating article as it shifts the conversation from where Americans struggle to where they actually flourish. I appreciated your emphasis on identifying environments and communities that foster health, purpose, and well-being rather than focusing exclusively on disease and dysfunction. One aspect that particularly resonated with me as a physician-scientist is the recognition that thriving is shaped by far more than income or geography alone. Social connection, economic opportunity, physical safety, education, access to healthcare, and a sense of belonging all contribute to human flourishing. Increasingly, medicine and public health recognize that these social determinants exert effects comparable to many traditional risk factors. Health is not merely an individual attribute but it emerges from the environments in which people live, work, and relate to one another.
For our longevity-focused patients and readers, I would love to add a context that thriving itself is multidimensional. A community may excel economically while struggling with social isolation, whereas another may foster strong social ties and life satisfaction despite fewer material advantages. This highlights an important principle in longevity science: extending lifespan without enhancing purpose, relationships, and quality of life misses much of what makes a long life worth living. Human flourishing cannot be reduced to a single metric.
What I find especially interesting is that many of the factors associated with thriving are remarkably consistent across cultures and generations. Strong relationships, meaningful work, physical activity, access to nature, and opportunities for lifelong learning repeatedly emerge as pillars of well-being. These findings suggest that while technology and economies evolve rapidly, the fundamental ingredients of a fulfilling life remain surprisingly enduring.
Thank you for sharing such an insightful perspective!
This is so relevant! I've spent stretches in both Lyon and Utrecht and they are utterly wonderful places with great culture, great transport, and tremendous beauty. I'd drop everything to live in either place in a heartbeat.
Excellent piece. I’d add Estonia to the list somewhere, but only for the warmest 3 months of the year 🤭 I’m apt to keep doing the Schengen Shuffle myself and be a perpetual renter.
Sure, but I don't let Russia's threats against the Baltics keep me out of Estonia any more than I let the USA's threats against Canada keep me out of my home country.
That’s a false dichotomy if I’ve ever seen one. There’s zero chance of the US ever invading Canada. Meanwhile Russia could invade its neighbors any day of this week and we wouldn’t be surprised. I think about it regularly.
As a Canadian whose home was on the redrawn map when Trump threatened to annex part of Canada not long ago, I disagree. Many of us took that seriously, and we’ve seen enough terrible things happen south of our border that we don’t brush his rantings off as just bluster.
That’s my point though, it was clearly all bluster. Trump’s an indisputable asshole but that’s on you if you actually took it seriously. It was never going to happen in reality. People catch TDS and suddenly lose the ability to think objectively.
I understand hating him for being an asshole, what I don’t get is how anyone could have ever thought there was a greater than zero possibility of the US invading Canada. Not saying that’s you, but it’s definitely a significant number of people.
Pretty simple- the US has to pay to defend Canada and Greenland (and the approaches to the US from those areas) because they are unwilling and unable to defend themselves.
Under Trudeau, Canada skimped on military spending and readiness declined greatly.
Trump’s message was simple for anyone who understood the situation and motivation;
1) step up, dramatically so
2) or pay us
3 or join us (which was always just trolling as the last thing Trump would want is another California without the tax revenue).
Carney instead counted on gullible Canadians who took Trump’s bluster literally and capitalized on the perennial undercurrent of hatred for American and Americans.
Now Trump (like most Americans) has gone back to not caring about Canada at all.
Can we not encourage them? The last thing Europe needs is more load brash ignorant racist Trump voting Americans. They can stay and fix their own screwed up country rather than bringing their ignorant religious fundamentalist views into Europe.
The Trump supporters I know consider European countries to be full of communists (because they don’t actually know anything economic and political systems) and cultural elitists and so they would never consider living there. It’s those of us who already travel and are more open-minded and want to learn and experience other ways to live and be within a community that are looking at Europe.
Europe is very welcoming to alternative cultures. Though every country clearly has its own nuances. Culturally Americans tend to be a lot louder than us. That can be challenging but I’m sure most yanks who travel are aware . Culturally as a Brit we get laughed at a lot for how often we say please and thank you. Cultural differences are fabulous when approached with consideration for the host nation. Just please, leave the Trump supporters there! We don’t want that type of attitude across the Atlantic.
I suggest you go on an American trip (maybe you’ve been there before). A lot of World Cup visitors this summer have been pleasantly impressed by the US. There’s a saying: if you want to hate America, listen/watch the news, if you want to love it, go visit it and meet the locals.
My friend the US has a lot to offer but right now it has zero appeal. The level of violence and threat to visitors is too high. You have your own people being shot in the street. Nuns being arrested by ICE. Your border patrol are turning people away at the border for disagreeing with your corrupt government. This doesn’t even take into account th le genocide your administration is complicit in. The impact of your illegal war on our economies. The mistreatment of allies by your administration. The erosion of women’s rights.
A friend was grilled for 30 minutes while his pregnant wife waited as border patrol shouted at my German passport friend because he was born in Madrid. The border patrol kept shouting that he was Mexican and to speak Spanish. The guy is a businessman. He’s never been to Mexico.
Racism is rife. People are being screamed at in the street for looking foreign. Children are getting shot in school, in shopping centres and at places of worship.
It’s not an attractive proposition right now.
I’ve been several times. I will not visit again. I’ll go to Canada or Mexico if I want to visit North America.
Magats and Trumpers don't travel. Let alone to think about moving to a foreign country. Travel is an antidote to ignorance, so definitely not on their list. They also think that ‘murica is the bestest biggest most fantastic place in the world.
I would have thought it was mostly people who dont like Trump et al that are leaving the US. Many are also moving to various parts of Asia, central and South America for a better climate and cheaper cost of living because they can’t afford to live as well in the US and a great many of them are retirees. Perhaps some articles on that might also help people decide. Many are just surviving on Pensions etc and aren’t very wealthy by a long shot.
1)WFH digital nomads looking to take advantage of flexibility to explore the world. This is a post-COVID phenomenon.
2)Retirees looking for a different experience or some stereotypical idyll they’ve been sold.
The rest (a minority) are a mixed bag of America or Trump haters, people with limited means looking to retire somewhere cheap (Latam, Asia) and people who have lived and worked overseas for much of their lives and are now retiring.
I’ve lived and worked in Europe and Asia, have foreign-born/dual citizen children and I speak several languages (one of my kids speaks seven) but I am a proud American and religious and somewhat conservative (apolitical though). I also love to travel and like challenging work assignments no matter where they are located (I can make a pleasant life most anywhere). I’ve done business in 30 countries and have managed employees in close to a dozen.
Europe is a very, very conservative place culturally. Generally much more racist,
more conformist, less optimistic, more whingey and less inclusive than the US. Many countries are, relative to the US in my experience. Some Americans may be loud and obnoxious and overly confident/optimistic, and our propensity to talk themselves up can be mind-numbing, but ask yourself whether you’d prefer to live in a culture that talks itself up or one whose greatest pleasure is taking someone else down? Usually I find the braggarts more entertaining than the petty although I’d prefer to avoid both. I thought about staying abroad permanently, but ultimately I did not want my children to spend their whole lives amidst that European mindset. I wanted them to have exposure to American optimism and sensibility while retaining an appreciation for other cultures and countries.
One doesn’t really understand a culture by visiting it nor even living there for a year or two. And nobody abroad really cares about your personal brand or political beliefs- once abroad, you are just an American.
Boston is lovely. I’ve been a couple of times and have lovely friends there. I feel awful for all those having to live in the USA who didn’t vote this shit show in. I feel worse for the world that’s having to deal with the fall out.
My background in terms of immigrant ancestry is all UK -- England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland. I live in Maine, so climate isn't really an issue. I wish it was more affordable for an older starving artist.
I am genuinely afraid of what will happen this autumn. Being in Maine, I am watching the Platner-Collins matchup for the US Senate seat with great trepidation. Planter is far from perfect personally, but the man has the correct platform on the issues. Collins is getting insane amounts of money from billionaires, largely because she keeps voting for their tax cuts. Our services here in Maine are difficult and getting worse. Rural hospitals close, including labor and delivery units, all the time. The childcare tax credit that would have helped so many struggling families in Maine, as well as across the US, failed because Collins pulled her support from it, and began raking in massive amounts of cash. That’s just a couple of issues. Then there are our forever wars, and Collins is on the wrong side of that, voting for every single blank check for the Pentagon. Platner served, saw things no human being can see and still stay untouched. He came back, struggled, works his way through his problems, and sees how our system fails ordinary people every single day. Get outside Portland and away from the summer people, and life up here is guttingly hard, and getting harder every single week as gasoline and diesel prices skyrocket. The problem is, the Republicans will cheat like crazy to keep Collins in her seat. And they are very good at rigging elections. I’ve started telling people to take their cellphones to the polls and photograph their ballots. We’re going to need the evidence.
So yeah, I want to load up my dog, my brushes, sketchbooks, and dry media, and get the hell out of here.
I’m so sorry you’re having to deal with that! We have a very different system and recently it’s been made even stricter. Wales went as far as making it illegal for politicians to lie to the public. A reaction to the lunacy of the Whitehouse.
I hope the November elections balances things to prevent the insanity getting by worse.
We have beautiful countryside and villages. Away from the cities it’s a slower pace of life. Long walks in the countryside. Everything an artist needs to breathe.
Take care of yourself. Don’t stress over what you can’t change.
Isn’t it more the Americans that regularly apologize for their country that move to Europe? At least historically that’s been the case. Just as insufferable as die hard trump supporters by the way.
Also, most of the diehard MAGA types don’t even have passports so I’m not sure where you’re getting the idea that trumpers are moving abroad en masse. During their president’s term, no less. Makes zero sense.
I pay 53% tax in Portugal. My 401k, my Social Security, all taxed. Rent is over $3000 in the center of Lisbon. It is more expensive to live here for me than the U.S.
Tax don’t reach 53% in Portugal, not to mention its progressive. Rents in central Lisbon are 3000 for maybe an apartment as big as a suburban house in the us, otherwise you find a comfortable 3 bedroom apartment for half that, or a two bedroom with a terrace. Yes, the city is expensive but for those who earn the salaries there because they are low in comparison with the rest of Western Europe and definitely the US
This is a great guide. But could we please stop with the expat nonsense. People want to move? Unless they are literally on a short term secondment with a job, they are immigrants. Let’s normalise this for everyone.
Who are you, and what are you trying to do here? I don't even consult personally. This list is as objective as I can make it, and in almost all cases is based on direct feedback from people living there. Also, when it comes to Italy, I tend to be extremely conservative (eventually, too much). I am not bound to a specific country, which puts me in a position to strive for objectivity. These are all things that those who have been following me on X for a while know very clearly.
I have no idea what angle you are coming from, nor what you are implying, but this is certainly not the right way to approach someone in the comments of a platform.
I’m wondering how the taxes and red tape pertain to an EU citizen vs an American one (I’m both). Will you be addressing that in your talk?
The difference between expats and immigrants is largely one of intent. Expats plan to return to their home country, while immigrants plan to stay permanently. In the beginning, we're all newcomers—it's our intentions that determine which label fits. xx
I like this framing. The word expat does still have connotations attached. And that may influence the reception someone receives. However your point about intent is very valid and well taken.
Baloney. It makes zero difference what somebody calls themselves; sometimes I consider myself an Expat, whatever that means, sometimes an immigrant, often a refugee from a dictatorship… But mainly I describe myself as somebody from another country who is very fortunate and very happy to live where I do. But go ahead and split hairs if that's your vibe, but this name nitpicking is just silly.
It's not really a framing. Denise is giving the correct difference in the definitions of the two terms.
The difference I see between expat and immigrant is largely one of social class. If you're affluent and have more choices, you call yourself an expat. It's a fallacy that immigrants intend to never leave. They often just can't.
Agreed. Generally western people are expats and brown people or eastern people are immigrants. Kind of wealth based and kind of racist. Agree with your definition personally
Pretty racist of YOU to assume “Americans” / “western people” doesn’t encompass brown or black or Asian people when they make up almost half the country eh? The author never said any race statements
Ex pats means non immigrant - ie not on or seeking a permanent visa. In some countries,like Dubai, that’s all you get so everybody is an ex pat.
I (US citizen) got to live overseas as an older child and teen (Australia — in the Outback, most of that time, and in Brussels). So I have prior experience of being an expat. And what it meant to integrate (or not) into the local community. And the two words do have nuanced meanings — as well as problematic ones.
We always knew we were coming back to the US. But after 40% (then) of my life outside the US, I got to come back as someone who knew the language, but was culturally displaced. That might well not be as true today — the internet changed a lot. But we never chose to live in the American ‘ghettos’. We made friends and lived in the community. In Brussels we frequently played volleyball with our Walloon neighbors. We chose not to live in the bubble of expats. I became relatively fluent in French, enough to travel using it (and be snubbed as much for my Brussels accent as my American one, especially in Paris), and dream in it. But we were expats. We were Yanks abroad who were coming home someday.
Now my wife and I are planning to immigrate (almost certainly to Portugal). And that means the mindset is different. Not that we couldn’t choose to return (*very* unlikely). Being an immigrant is different from being an expat. You intend to stay, and you intend to integrate. You’re not a visitor.
And yes, there are folks who misuse “expat,” but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t have a meaning distinct from “immigrant.” (Nor that some of the folks misusing it are racists.)
I agree but not all white people were colonisers. Some were indeed colonised. Let’s respect nuances also. My point is, let’s simplify the language. Those who migrate are e/im-migrants. And migration has benefits so I am not suggesting all migration should stop.
The quality of life in much of Europe is higher than the US - a move there is often not romantic but realistic. Unless you just love cheese from a spray can, military dominance, wrestling, and canyons. Which might explain why you are tired with reading about it so often.
Maybe stop with the stereotypes too. Nothing in your last sentence describes where I live in NJ, 15 miles from Manhattan. Sometimes it helps to remember that the US is as large and as populous, and therefore, different, as all of Western Europe.
That's true Mike, but it's also true that no matter where you go in the US, you're stewing in a fetid soup of toxic selfishness and a wildly inflated sense of entitlement. It's baked into American culture. Selfishness is the main reason I left. Portugal is a breath of fresh air - the default here is what's good for everybody first and foremost.
I understand where you are coming from and I don't disagree with what I think your underlying message is.
However, I'm an American retiree in Lisbon. If we're going to be brutally honest, "expat" is a more accurate description of most of my compatriots here (I'm speaking specifically about retired people) because even if you intend to stay long term or permanently it's somewhere between difficult to impossible to truly integrate as much as you might want to. Plus, many of us (by no means all) are in an economically relatively privileged position and could go back to the US tomorrow if we wanted to. And, most retirees here who can afford to spend every second they are allowed to be outside of Portugal traveling outside the country (true of me and my spouse). Most retirees don't learn enough Portuguese to have a meaningful conversation in the language, and socialize primarily with other foreigners. There are some Portuguese people who choose to be part of primarily immigrant/expat networks that I'm part of or aware of but any associated activities happen in English.
I've been in LIsbon just short of five years and speak B2 Portuguese. In this entire time there are a grand total of three Portuguese people I've ever had a social encounter with in Portuguese and only one of those is currently in the picture. (This is nothing about Portuguese people, it's just the reality of moving to a different country as a retiree). By contrast I could be doing some kind of social activity every day with Americans here if I wanted to.
I'd love to find a way to integrate more into Portugual but honestly I have no idea how to do that. And, I and many other Americans are starting to feel a little less welcome here with recent changes in nationality laws. I'm open to possibilities but for now I'm happy enough living mostly in my American bubble with some rare forays outside of it.
I guess anyone who reads this for themselves can decide whether I'm really an immigrant or an expat. To the extent I think of myself as an expat it's less that I'm trying to distance myself from some negative image of "immigrants" and more an acknowledgement of the incredible privilege I have as an American relative to people who come here to escape poverty in Africa and South Asia.
Thank you for the honesty. Indeed, any move is not easy. Even within a country one is familiar with. You describe the challenges well. Integrating into a new society takes a lot of continuous effort and often some luck to hit on the right entry point. I still hold that the word expat has associations and connotations that many may not be totally aware of. Good wishes for your continued efforts at integration.
Thanks. I would agree that the word expat has associations and connotations and would probably agree with you about what those are. And I think all of them probably apply to at least some retired people from other places in Europe.
One other thing I would say is that while there may be some limits to how much I can integrate here (some due to things about me, some due to cultural difference and coming at an older age), I do try to integrate in spirit as much as possible. First by learning the language to the best of my ability, reading Portuguese books, magazines and newspapers, listeining to Portuguese music, learning about the history of the country, keeping up with current events. following a Portuguese football team, rooting for the national team in the World Cup. I feel like doing that enhances my experience of living here.
If you are supporting Portugal in the World Cup you are well on your way to integration!
Thanks Ken for your post. I understand your experiences , but as a semi expat and retiree, flipping between NYC and Barcelona, all the friends I have in the latter city are Spaniards. Yes, they do speak english which makes things easier. Like yourself I speak B2 Spanish and now B1 Catalan. Both are very helpful in day to day experiences.
Most friends I have made are (not so many ) thru language exchanges and meetups, despite being a senior and my friends being at least 10 years younger.
Still, as a single person it can be lonely at times. But I love Barcelona and the Spanish culture.
My biggest concern, though not a problem yet, has been the Spanish tax authorities. I make sure to never spend 183 days, and become tax resident, tho I am a Spanish citizen. I have accessed the health care system and paid out of pocket at emergency rooms, but get 80% remimbursement with my secondary medical plan in the US. "
I look at the experience as a late in life journey and make the best of it.
I love how you and I agree and I get lambasted (ripped to shreds while being personally insulted) by OP while you are praised foro saying virtually the same thing. Wow. The cognitive dissonance on this thread is wild.
I thought this the other day. The romanticizing of Europe is getting old. Just go visit. Or find a good café where you live. Or open one.
As a European, I have to say I really enjoy being on this continent. But life is life. People who make a (semi) permanent move are emigrants / immigrants. No issue with that but please,integrate; you are in someone else’s country for a while. Not an expat, an immigrant.
You clearly do have an issue with it. You are telling an entire large group of people who move to “your continent” how to act and behave as if learning another language or another lifestyle is easy *snaps fingers*. Why don’t you have a little grace and let people do what works best for them in their own time? WHY DO YOU CARE?
Oh dear, you really don’t hear it from a different perspective do you? I tried to share what people will think but not say. I will leave it here.
Also “why do you care” was my question but in typical online fashion you don’t answer the question. You turn it around on me as if my disagreement with you is the problem. Open your mind
I did answer that. I have pointed out multiple times that the term expat holds connotations, that Americans often don’t seem to understand that and then register (aurally or subconsciously) a shift in people’s attitudes towards them and may be confused by that shift which then plays out as locals being ‘rude’ etc etc. The issue is not what the word means per the dictionary, it is the assumptions and connotations it holds. But really, if you have not understood that in this entire thread, I am not sure what else I can say which would be useful.
Take your own advice Danielle.
I would argue that you don’t want to hear an accurate depiction of what the words mean. I don’t care what people say …. you do. You’re the one who started this whole conversation by saying what terminology we should use or not use - “can we stop using the term expat” “it means the same thing as immigrant” (it doesn’t) and then you try to (now) place the blame on “many people are saying”. How about you just let people call themselves what they are comfortable with and stop dictating what “other people say”? I’ve finished my point.
Wow, really Danielle? Try reading your comment out loud to yourself and see how it sounds.
Disagree. I often hear people complain about the word "expat", but they're just wrong.
Expats don't intent to stay for life in their new nation, get a local passport, become a citizen... Immigrants do.
It has nothing to do with race, class, wealth.
How do so many people abandon the common sense of your statement?
It may not have originally, but it certainly does now.
I don't think it is just the term either - often it can be the attitude that comes with it.
Yes I guess it’s more like romanticizing immigration, to the point of calling it something else.
With all the due respect, this is as reliable as any Forbes ‘best of’ list.
AI generated cliches to please the eye and name dropping to please the algorithm.
It’s fine if the purpose (as it is) is to sell relocation advice, but - at least when it comes to Italy - it’s far from the reality. Starting from the data.
7% scheme is not working. In the past a few hundreds used it, a total fiscal policy failure and don’t expect it is automatically granted.
One euro houses - you are right here.
The ‘Ostuni’ bit… have you actually been to Ostuni?
Please don’t confuse the postcard with real Italy.
Who are you, and what are you trying to do here? I don't even consult personally. This list is as objective as I can make it, and in almost all cases is based on direct feedback from people living there. Also, when it comes to Italy, I tend to be extremely conservative (eventually, too much). I am not bound to a specific country, which puts me in a position to strive for objectivity. These are all things that those who have been following me on X for a while know very clearly.
I have no idea what angle you are coming from, nor what you are implying, but this is certainly not the right way to approach someone in the comments of a platform.
Your article is AI generated and it is boring to read a machine made text, you didn’t even edit out the LLM cliches. Your comment, though, is genuine. In your reply to ITS Italy you showed your human side! I sensed anger, frustration, and even a bit of shame. Now, I see the face of the author. Your AI written article, on the other hand, is a machine text. I can ask chatgpt to compile this list. The fact that you have friends in these places does not negate the use of LLM.
Nonsense. PC bullshit. This is the simplistic definition creep of our era, where many nuances are now siloed into single categories. Everything is racist, for example, which is all over these comments. I've traveled for decades and nobody I've ever met said "I'm an immigrant."
Alfred! Chill! You’re acting like a brat.
OFFS. Stop already with the goofy hair splitting. I live in Europe and I don't give a damn what people call me; ex Pat, immigrant, refugee… Sometimes I'm one sometimes I'm the other. I just consider myself a person who was very fortunate to live where I do. Grow up.
The word ex pat comes from “expatriate”. It’s an ACTUAL word in English. So maybe look it up and see that it doesn’t mean the same thing as immigrant which means to immigrate somewhere. Why do you care what we call ourselves ? I can very easily be both and have it not be offensive to anyone - except you I guess. As an American not living in America my home country I’m an ex pat. As an American living in Portugal now I’m an immigrant. You want to define me but why does it matter? You’re putting a race, class or socio-economic meaning on the terms, not me.
Actually in many countries, the term expat (as opposed to any other term used to describe people who move country) holds very specific connotations. That is what people are trying to tell Americans. If Americans don’t want to hear that, then they cannot also be surprised when there is an instinctive response to the use of this word. I am not here to create a polemic around this. Just politely trying to flag that the term expat has connotations.
Wow. Just wow. You're the kind of American I moved here to get away from. I don't know where you live, but I hope it's a very long way from where I live.
I would be beyond thrilled to not run into another old white dude who thinks he paved the way to immigrating (see what I did there?) in Europe. Feel free to avoid Lisbon and the surrounding areas and we’ll be fine Old man.
It seems you are the one with the problem because of your attitude and it’s people like you who give others a bad name unfortunately.
Is this addressed to me?
No it popped+up here for sone season when I was trying to respond to another nasty piece of work by Noel Keith who seems to have it in for so called Boomers who are in his opinion very wealthy and causing him to be poor….lol For some reason it jumped out if that part of the thread and ended up here and I couldn’t change it or move it to where I meant it was meant to go so sorry about that. I agree with your posts really.
I don't think Noel is an actual person. I think that he may be a bot programmed to stir up anger. His account looks strange.
No problem at all.
I have lived outside of the USA for over 30 years and even became a citizen of one of the European countries mentioned, but I will still, upon occasion, use both words, immigrant and expat, to describe my milieu and others who live in it with me. The article made it clear there is no “one size fits all”. Thanks for all of the helpful information.
It was pointed out to me recently, the racism in the term. Generally only white (and privileged) people are called expat.
So glad that all the boomers who retired rich off of a dysfunctional and highly leveraged housing market so they can go and enjoy socialized medicine, walkable cities, investments in education and clean energy.
Ya know, all the things they voted against for the last 50-60 years.
Unfortunately, most boomers don't fall in that category. Thru worked hard expecting a retirement that looked quite different from what they got. The wealthy always do well.
I have lots of stats for you to misconstrue and argue with, boomer, but I’m not going to bother because your demented self cannot even use grammar at this point.
You sound like a trump voter: resentful and entitled. I don’t appreciate being lumped into some fantasy you use to justify failing to meet your own expectations. I’m not “house rich,” don’t own a home, worked my ASS off as a single parent so that I could afford to pay my bills when I retired. I’m by no means wealthy; I’m solvent. I never lived beyond my means - which meant living in a cheap one bedroom apartment until my daughter was 8 years old. I’m a democrat. I’ve never once voted to destroy the earth, the climate or my neighbors’ health and well being. So STFU.
Thank you. Noel Keith doesn't seem to understand that most boomers got screwed like those who followed. Every generation has the wealthy that do just fine. And I do believe GenZ is getting the worst of it with even less opportunity, but it's just as ignorant to blame a generation for all the ills of this nation as it is to blame immigrants. Look up. It's the tech bros and other oligarchs.
Hey now, what convenient timing to say, "look over there!" because of the SpaceX IPO. Hahahahaha
Which generation consistently voted to pull up the ladder after they benefitted and still does today?
Well, if all boomers are wealthy, all Gen X must be wealthy like Musk. Right? Because yes, the middle class worked our butts off then pulled up the ladder to make sure our kids got screwed. Make sense of that. Blame boomers if it makes you feel good, but if you want change, you need to figure out who is screwing us all to the wall. If you prefer whining, have at it.
Baby Boomers hold the majority of U.S. household wealth at over 51% (more than $85 trillion), despite comprising only about a fifth of the population. Generation X holds approximately 26%, while Millennials and Gen Z account for around 11%
Your generation has been in charge of damn near everything public, nonprofit, and private since ‘92 AND LOOK WHERE WE ARE NOW.
Baby Boomers hold the majority of U.S. household wealth at over 51% (more than $85 trillion), despite comprising only about a fifth of the population. Generation X holds approximately 26%, while Millennials and Gen Z account for around 11%
Your generation has been in charge of damn near everything public, nonprofit, and private since ‘92 AND LOOK WHERE WE ARE NOW.
Musk has more wealth than almost 50% of the world. I guess if boomers are responsible for everything from adulthood till today, you see us as homogeneous. But like Gen X, the wealth of their generation and those that followed is held by a small group of individuals known as the tech bros. That's how life is. So, instead of victim blaming, because we are all victims of the oligarchs, I've just been victimized longer, we should be clear on where the blame belongs because it's going to take all of us to make real change. I have children. I want a better life for them.
You are completely changing your position with this comment. Also, do you know what a straw person is? Plus bringing Musk up at all is a red herring.
Are you fundamentally dishonest or just demented?
You sound like a MAGA incel screeching about “nOt aLL mEn” when I give you facts that contradict the earlier position that you took directly out of your exhaust pipe.
Oh and please explain to me why a poor disabled guy is entitled or is blaming others for his own problems.
You keep saying you’re a disabled guy. What’s your disability? Were you born with? Is it due to a work injury? Are you a disabled veteran? Just curious…
If I thought that there was even the remotest chance that you were engaging me honestly then I’d tell you.
I can't really evaluate whatever your view might be. I just wonder how does anyone become so hateful and full of bile as your comments?
Nope, I come with facts. No where have I said that I hate an entire generation. I do want you to own the reality of it but that’s all. Besides, an ad hominem is what you’re gonna open up with? That literally means you’re a fool with nothing to say.
Your generation voted to pull the ladder up behind them for 50 years.
Your generation has 1/5 of the population but also over 1/2 of the wealth. And you had more wealth at their age than X and Millennials do now. Also you’ve been in charge of almost everything public/private/nonprofit since ‘92 and look where we are.
I hope you don’t live anywhere but the US and thereby inflict your rather Trump sounding opinions on others. Don’t try and label me as a boomer from the US because I am a boomer from somewhere else. I doubt I’d waste my time talking to you if I ever had the misfortune to cross paths with you as you seem to have a large resentful chip on your shoulder.
I am physically disabled and I use my real name and face on here. I have been writing quality content in service of the resistance since Jan ‘25. I have been physically assaulted for gathering signatures and still I keep getting out here in Arkkkansas to protest and to knock on doors.
Boomers have been in charge of everything almost public, private, and nonprofit since ‘92 and look where we are. You have over half the wealth with only 1/5 of the population. You voted Trump more than any other generation.
And yet here you are with this stupid purity testing. Total covert Narcissist territory.
Go fuck yourself with a Katana, TWICE.
Ok, Boomer?
"I have been writing quality content..." Wrong. You're a hateful troll.
You’re the one trolling me, boomer.
You seem to believe that being disabled is a license to abuse other people. Mistreatment of others is probably the least intelligent way to go through life. Treating others ethically is not only the right thing to do, it is the smart thing to do. You have zero knowledge of the people who you attack yet are so angry with them. Life can be difficult for many different reasons and playing the victim doesn't help anyone, you least of all. If you don't have a therapist one is definitely a good idea. I have a mentally ill daughter who came to me when she was six. She is abusive like you are and like you, she too often feels isolated and afraid. Angry people don't bother me other than the sadness felt from watching another human being actively self destucting. Noel, Think about it logically. If you spew insults at people for aging how is it just for you to whine over lack of kindness for being disabled? It isn't, if you try to stop being a person who makes the world an uglier place, you will feel less miserable from day to day.No one here caused your mental illness,your disability, your poverty, or your fear disguised as anger. BTW your boomer facts are skewed. Many of the obscenely wealthy people happen to be boomers. Many of us live without financial security. Using statistics without context can confuse someone into belief outside of the reality that we live in. You are angry with the wrong group of people. Have you ever asked yourself how finding things to feel angry about improves your existence? I have the answer for you, it doesn't.
This article hits home for me as a boomer. We’ve been brainwashed since birth and most of us, rich and poor, are still living in the world of American exceptionalism. To my fellow generation, we all need to wake up from our narcissistic bubble before we die. Stop watching CNN, Fox News, etc etc and start thinking critically about the country as it’s become. We have been voting for this mess for 50 years. And stop being scared of socialism.
Dude! If you’re living in a narcissistic fantasy of “American exceptionalism” that’s on you. Don’t lump me in with your bullshit. I’m a “late boomer” (😉) and have no illusions about what our country is and ALWAYS HAS BEEN. We started out racist and intolerant. We had one little bubble of tolerance and brotherly love. When we elected Barack Obama we fell victim to the idea that maybe things would be different and better from now on. Trump’s election disabused us of that folly. The only surprise for me was just how many Americans are dumb as a box of rocks.
Congratulations! Enjoy your mea culpa.
And fyi - all those corporations that destroyed the planet and our standard of living were run by republicans (for the most part). That has more to do with where we’re at than age.
The gerontocracy and the oligarchy are mostly the same thing so good job on missing the point entirely.
Nicely put, I thank you for such a thoughtful comment 🙏
Sadly, the morally superior tone and defensiveness of the comments only proves your point. So much denial.....
It’s like some folks are living all the way down the denial river 🤷♂️
I am not here to argue with you. I am genuinely curious what you get from going online to spend time interacting with people without civility, using tactics better suited to the kindergarten playground, and insulting the people who you respond to?
Do you have an extremely unhappy life and need to vent rage? Do you not like yourself and take out the feeling on strangers? I am sincerely asking what is the reward you receive from going online to be unpleasant to those who you encounter?
Seriously, you’ve come back to different threads where I’m not even replying to you to moralize and complain.
I’m here to talk facts, it’s not my fault you decrepit boomers are all triggered by them.
I find the lack of emotional regulation to the point of insults and name calling to be destructive (as do many people from varying fields who have decades of knowledge) and humiliating for people who are adults.
Civil debate is an exchange of ideas that is often useful in providing solutions.
Squabbling is useless and is only noise. There is nothing productive in it.
Yes, we all know that you’re a moralizing moron who spends their time tone policing.
😆
lol the dipshit tone police are back!!
You’re the one that keeps on coming back to troll me, you dusty old fart 💨
You are hilarious. Your insults are of course not applicable because you have no knowledge of the people who you insult.
It is actually worse than my trolling you. I never gave you a thought at all, lol.
You remind me of the unhappy little boys on the playground who run around being mean to smaller kids and in imagination believe they are seen as strong and tough, by other people.
I was curious to know if you actually get something out of it?
If you are too shy to respond, lol, no worries. I chose to ask you because you figuratively run around being mean to so many people it makes you easy to locate, lol.
I know plenty about the stupid fuckers who troll me, like you.
You let all kinds of things slip.
I came here with facts and you never addressed them, you dishonest & demented boomer.
I can use grammar, and I'd challenge you to any stats you want to put up. But you won't, because that would require you to do some actual homework, which I strongly suspect you are incapable of or unwilling to do to support you sweeping generalizations of people you don't know.
Hmmm, another boomer hater, seems like they come to the surface like angle worms in the rain...
As you say, I've got lots to say... but I'm not going to bother because your blah blah blah...
Worked two jobs, busted my ass and am around that I chose a living wage union construction career..
That still pays a pension, vacation, 25% into an annuity and time and a half and double time...
And if you travel.. per diem.
Only problem...
You got to work real hard, and get dirty.
Nope, I come with facts. No where have I said that I hate an entire generation. I do want you to own the reality of it but that’s all. Besides, an ad hominem is what you’re gonna open up with? That literally means you’re a fool with nothing to say.
Your generation voted to pull the ladder up behind them for 50 years.
Your generation has 1/5 of the population but also over 1/2 of the wealth. And you had more wealth at their age than X and Millennials do now. Also you’ve been in charge of almost everything public/private/nonprofit since ‘92 and look where we are.
This comment was about the entire generation. How come every triggered old fart responds with ‘me’ and ‘I’?
Nope, I come with facts. No where have I said that I hate an entire generation. I do want you to own the reality of it but that’s all. Besides, an ad hominem is what you’re gonna open up with? That literally means you’re a fool with nothing to say.
Your generation voted to pull the ladder up behind them for 50 years.
Your generation has 1/5 of the population but also over 1/2 of the wealth. And you had more wealth at their age than X and Millennials do now. Also you’ve been in charge of almost everything public/private/nonprofit since ‘92 and look where we are.
This comment was about the entire generation. How come every triggered old fart responds with ‘me’ and ‘I’?
I was a pharmacist working 2 jobs and too busy to take the time to invest properly. But your point is well taken. Every time HVAC is out, I get sticker shock that makes me regret every choice I've made in life. And, blah, blah, blah.
It’s not an entire generation and not just you, you dusty old liar.
You seem to lump pretty much everybody here together regardless of what they say. So who's the liar Noel? You're a bitter, petty, small, hateful, pathetic person. Enjoy the rest of your bitter, hateful, pathetic life.
Ah yes. Gotta love the ageist BS cropping up everywhere on the interwebz.
Aww it’s so precious that you used a 90’s term with interwebs. I got another 90’s term for ya: DUH!
Baby Boomers hold the majority of U.S. household wealth at over 51% (more than $85 trillion), despite comprising only about a fifth of the population. Generation X holds approximately 26%, while Millennials and Gen Z account for around 11%
Your generation has been in charge of damn near everything public, nonprofit, and private since ‘92 AND LOOK WHERE WE ARE NOW.
What was BS? These are facts.
We also often worked 70 to 90 hours per week. I did and spent all the money raising kids who were alone in the world and have very little now. When you generalize you are fundamentally inaccurate overall.
So did we and you actually got yours. Then pulled the ladder up on us before we climbed it.
Dusty old fart tone policing repeatedly for a week now. I should write an article on your decrepit ass.
You are hilarious. I am probably in better shape physically than you are. Have you done any triathlons lately?
Noel sounds bitter.
Settle down, Noel.
Trisha, Trisha, Trisha. LOL you make me laugh. My ex wife and I BOTH worked. We are far from wealthy. Have you gone into a grocery store, or a Target or elsewhere and never seen boomers in there working?
I would have a bit of respect for you if your claim was somrwhat nuanced. Not every boomer has, like, 4 houses and 2 Ferraris. Sweetie pie, get a clue. Sorry baby girl, if you don't like it, take a look in the mirror.
Sexist pig
Insults and name calling only serve to make people look as if they have nothing intelligent to add to a debate. If you allow excessive emotion to make you do that people feel justified in ignoring you. I didn't like how the man belittled you. From the outside looking in he came out seeming to be the more intelligent in spite of his lack of kindness. Please try to calm down. Anger hurts you more than anyone else in the end.
I would say about 2% of the Americans living in Europe are that. Those afraid of socialized medicine are also afraid of living in Europe.
You’re swooping in to pull statistics out of your ass, huh?
And on top of that it’s an irrelevant claim as well. Too bad this conversation is about boomers who made out and pulled up the ladder after them who are JUST NOW retiring to move over there.
It was you who swooped in to shit in this article. As far as relevence, by your logic we could blame the Jews for voting in the Nazis-they were present, they were of the correct age-it must be their fault. Swoop away now.
No, it was about boomers like you who cannot accept that your generation has been in charge since ‘92 and LOOK WHERE WE ARE.
Oh and comparing yourself to Jews in the holocaust just because I presented FACTs is as sick and fragile as a Trump.
Presenting a logical analagy is completely legit. Do you blame German Jews for Hitler? You are claiming that all members a group should be blamed for the acts of some. That's the definition of predudice. What group are you, Keith? Is your group able to vote? Did any of them vote for Trump?
A local analogy?
No, you claimed a specific number statistic and now you cannot own up to opening up with whole cloth fabrication.
I come with facts. Fucking dipshit charlatan.
No, I am not blaming each and every boomer. I am telling the fragile little shits who can’t own it to go fuck themselves.
Got anything better than a straw person or an outright lie, boomer?
Who said we can't accept anything Noel? Nowhere here has anyone said they don't accept that our generation has been in charge, and pretty much everybody can see where we are. So once again, you're lumping everybody (that you don't know anything about) into one big category and making baseless, sweeping accusations with absolutely no facts whatsoever.
You’re the one trolling me, you nameless and faceless coward.
Trisha- full disclosure . I am a boomer and clearly see the plight adults under 40 face in this economy/society . And the wealth disparity is obvious as well. But i would note there were times when the economy was underwater and jobs were scare as well (~1980). The sequence risk of when you graduated from college was palpable, however, things always seemed to turn around in less than five years or so and we could afford rents esp with roommates. But the game HAS been rigged to favor those with assets *(ie own their homes and ‘stonks”) and COSTS have risen so dramatically , and the bottom has fallen out in our education system. Of course if you graduate these days from UC Berkeley with a French lit degree good luck finding a decent job, That said, it doenst all fall on greedy boomers. Even re our politics . There were plenty of young people who voted for Trump -TWICE!- and globalization has lifted hundreds of millions of Chinese and third world humans out of poverty, but it has meant inflation in US and forced many women reluctantly into the full time work force. But all of Americans need to spend less time on intergenerational hating and looking for solution. As you note, boomers have skin back in the game now with their grandchildren. We need to truly reform and truly financially support universal k-12 education, day care and put all kids on Medicaid until they are 22, and end the disparity between taxes on capital and income, and allow student debt to be treated like any other form of debt. What we DONT need is more unprepared and disinterested kids wasting 4 years taking obviously unemployable majors, federal support that simply raises the cost of Tuition and housing. mortgages. What we need is 1)a great k-12 eduction for all kids, but this will require half the country agreeing to 100k plus teachers salaries and national standards, and the other half to require teachers major in their disciplines rather than attend “teachers” colleges and submit to they themselves being graded; 2) provide at least as good health care for children as we do for the elderly and end this crazy paradox where grandma gets admitted to Mass General with walking pneumonia and her grandchildren cant afford to go to the ER in a diabetic crisis.
The truth is the Socialized medicine is bad. You wait years and the doctors don’t care. Unless you see and pay them in their private practice.
Walkable cities, no not really. Immigrants from third world countries have made most of these cities and Europe in general unsafe to walk. Rapes have climbed through the roof. These primitive cultures are not punished for their crimes and are thus emboldened to commit more. Especially against women, children, and the elderly.
Clean energy?! Are you kidding?!
Solar is a scam. Solar and wind are completely UNRELIABLE which leads to its having extremely expensive or having absolutely 0 electricity when you need it most such as extreme heat or freezing weather.
I’m looking at you Spain, Portugal, Germany and France.
Or how about Germany shutting down it’s nuclear plants so it can burn the dirtiest coal imaginable, buy fuel from Russia, and completely de industrialize it’s manufacturing sector?
The end result more pollution, more poverty, and a government that fails to correct.
China sold the world Solar and wind while they built thousands of coal burning plants, roughly two a week or the past three years, at least! We all breathe the same air.
No one in the world owns more coal burning plants then China.
Yet interestingly, no one demonizes China for utilizing Coal more than any other country in the world ?!
Strange that, hmmmm.
China is not stupid enough to fall for solar and wind( though they hold the monopoly on rare earth minerals and slave labor/in the mining sector)
China depends on Coal, and dictatorships for their oil.
So no, Europe has zero Dependable Energy. You have been reading too many headlines. Do your own research and try for some long term critical thinking.
Europe will be in a world of hurt this winter and it’s looking to intimidate and censor it’s citizens as aggressively as possible now.
If you are not happy in the US you are not only ungrateful but exceedingly ignorant of what is happening in Europe, Africa, and the East. Because this is just a drop in the bucket.
Racist ignoramus
Go get yourself a booster mate.
Nameless and faceless coward of a racist says I’m his mate?
I'm living in France and own my first home. I am retired. I am very aware of my good fortunes, however. I was able to have a good career that I loved with a decent steady income. The career also came with a very good final salary pension. Good jobs with longevity existed when i started. Now it is harder to find these kinds of jobs plus almost no pensions are based on final (generally highest) salaries.
I was able to save money and started investing early. Why? Because the cost of living was not as high and I didn't have children. Life, therefore, was not as expensive but perhaps not as fulfilling as having children would have allowed.
I learned financial.planning at home and at school. Debt was severely frowned upon but as noted one could live without needing credit...or very much.
My education (3 degrees to PhD level plus one associate degree) was very inexpensive. I was able to leave education with no debt.
The current environment has few of the benefits I was afforded and I am aware of my good fortune. I am not rich but I can live without financial worry.
That we could improve the systems for young people so they to could live with fewer worries.
I hear you and thank you for your thoughtful comment.
I do worry (assuming that you are an American expatriate) that you cannot affect change as easily from there without presence at protests, organizing, or volunteership; plus MAGA is likely going to continue to assail voting by mail.
Stop being an ageist. Most boomers aren’t wealthy and are living on social security. We worked for 50 years. You have white male entitlement, which goes along with the self pity party
I have plenty of actual stats in this conversation and would copy and paste them here once again but I don’t bother with dusty old farts.
Why are you a dusty old fart?
It’s because opening with Ad Hominem demonstrates both your foolishness and your lack of anything to say.
What do you think happens to privilege when I’m mentally and physically disabled?
Eat a box of 💩, Liz
I'd invite you not to lump all boomers (which I barely qualify as) into one group, so as not to make yourself sound like such an ignoramus. I'm about as far left a Liberal as they come in the US (barely center left by European standards). I worked hard for my retirement, and I sacrificed a lot to get where I am. I'm far from rich, but by Portuguese standards I'm pretty well off. But I don't flash that around. And for the record, I have private health insurance here, and I've never used the public system for anything but prescriptions (where you have no choice). That kind of attitude toward others you don't know is a big reason I left the US.
Why can’t we have a conversation about the generation as a whole without dusty old farts like you getting offended?
Why can’t any of you open with something other than Ad Hominem and triggered babbling. This is not about you personally, dumbass. Save your pathetic life story for someone who cares.
Who said I'm offended Noel? Quote where I said that. If you're curious who's triggered here, go back and read every single one of your posts in this thread out loud to yourself, looking in the mirror. Then get back to us about who's triggered.
By not having grown past name calling you limit your ability to interest other people into feeling anything but wanting you to go away. My dad taught me when I was three that when you begin to insult people and deteriorate into name calling other people feel justified in not giving any credence to what you communicate. You don't write like someone who has been well educated. You behave in a way that is similar to Trump's behavior. This is why you are mistaken for a Trump supporter. You waste time and energy on attacking and blaming. Attacking and blaming are Trump's signature methods of communication. Do you really not see the similarities?
Nope, I come with facts. No where have I said that I hate an entire generation. I do want you to own the reality of it but that’s all. Besides, an ad hominem is what you’re gonna open up with? That literally means you’re a fool with nothing to say.
Your generation voted to pull the ladder up behind them for 50 years.
Your generation has 1/5 of the population but also over 1/2 of the wealth. And you had more wealth at their age than X and Millennials do now. Also you’ve been in charge of almost everything public/private/nonprofit since ‘92 and look where we are.
This comment was about the entire generation. How come every triggered old fart responds with ‘me’ and ‘I’?
Noel, it’s unsurprising older generations have more wealth than younger generations. What is new/surprising is the lack of opportunity for similar age cohorts and recognition millenials /genz may NOT have same wealth boomers did, BUT nb there is a huge wealth transfer just starting to take shape between boomers and their kids-where things will get grim is when millenials and younger find THEY cant help our help kids or transfer a lot of accumulated wealth. Im less worried that Elon musk is a trillion wire per se (though there are a host of baleful second order effects -DOGE, antitrust, SCE violations etc) than i am my grandchildren wont have a stock portfolio/assets of meaningful or their children will have to attend private school to get a good education. The “american equation “ doenst pencil ou any longer, and yes the boomers got theirs, but thats as much a function of globalization , poor policy, huge immigration inflows with out commensurate cultural integration, eroding social and political cohesion , and technological progress as it is boomer avarice.
And why is that? Did you go back to school to start a completely new career from scratch at 42 like I did? I can't help that you're struggling, but being bitter at the success of others just makes you a very small person.
No, insect.
I’m published in Epidemiology, hold degrees in Math & Economics, and have federal statistics certifications. Who the fuck are you to say I’m illiterate?
You opened with fundamental dishonesty and we’re not gonna talk about anything else until you admit it.
Who said you're illiterate, Noel? Quote where anybody said that. I'm more than happy for you not to talk about anything else. Ever. At all. With anybody. You're pathetic.
Prague was my personal favorite
Trisha- full disclosure . I am a boomer and clearly see the plight adults under 40 face in this economy/society . And the wealth disparity is obvious as well. But i would note there were times when the economy was underwater and jobs were scare as well (~1980). The sequence risk of when you graduated from college was palpable, however, things always seemed to turn around in less than five years or so and we could afford rents esp with roommates. But the game HAS been rigged to favor those with assets *(ie own their homes and ‘stonks”) and COSTS have risen so dramatically , and the bottom has fallen out in our education system. Of course if you garage these days from UC Berkeley with a French lit degree good luck finding a decent job, That said, it doenst all fall on greedy boomers. Even re our politics . There were plenty of young people who voted for Trump -TWICE!- and globalization has lifted hundreds of millions of Chinese and third world humans out of poverty, but it has meant inflation in US and forced many women reluctantly into the full time work force. But all of Americans need to spend less time on intergenerational hating and looking for solution. As you note, boomers have skin back in the game now with their grandchildren. We need to truly reform and truly financially support universal k-12 education, day care and put all kids on Medicaid until they are 22, and end the disparity between taxes on capital and income, and allow student debt to be treated like any other form of debt. What we DONT need is more unprepared and disinterested kids wasting 4 years taking obviously unemployable majors, federal support that simply raises the cost of Tuition and housing. mortgages. What we need is 1)a great k-12 eduction for all kids, but this will require half the country agreeing to 100k plus teachers salaries and national standards, and the other half to require teachers major in their disciplines rather than attend “teachers” colleges and submit to they themselves being graded; 2) provide at least as good health care for children as we do for the elderly and end this crazy paradox where grandma gets admitted to Mass General with walking pneumonia and her grandchildren cant afford to go to the ER in a diabetic crisis.
There’s also a lot to be said for unions being at a 100 year low in membership mostly due right to work laws that proliferated since the 80’s. As soon as that happened, wages stopped going up with profits (as they had been rising together since WWII)
And that’s not just economics, union meetings are many folks’ introduction to politics and they can very much see for themselves that the rich are not their friends.
I appreciate your balanced comment and the education and healthcare notions are indeed important.
That said, I have no sympathy for the early 80’s recession when millennials have been dealing with recessions half the time since ‘03.
Millennials are poorest living generation while being the most educated. And no, it’s not because of college majors that you don’t approve of. We did what we were supposed to but as a group the boomers voted to pull the ladder up behind them.
And yeah, there were some Gen X, Z and millennials who voted for Trump but millennials voted for Democrats the most and Boomers voted for Trump the most. So I am not sure why you brought that up.
Thanks for the response and be well in this unholy year ✌️
Noel - 1.no question that to work and union declines are a factor, but im also struck by how expensive non union wages are (albeit necessary to survive in this economy) 2. I should have been clearer on recessions during boomer launch years- we were never hit with cyclical issues like younger generations, even if the sequencing risk was apparent then. Major difference is we had confidence things would turn around and they did. Younger generations lack that conviction and they are arguably correct. 3. Boomers could be indifferent about their major and get jobs, and I vividly recall getting a 2% college loan that didn’t start until AFTER i got my graduate degree -I cried the day i had to pay it off at age 35 ! And yes there was an industry that encouraged kids to go to college who clearly had no interest or yes-ability-to succeed academically In college. And yes we did pull rug out by changing rules to make educational loans non dischargeable i bankruptcy . But we’ve known for some time too many kids are attending colleges that have little impact on their wage futures. Bt it’s already been demonstrated government cant/wont absorb these debts yet so many people are hobbled by what $200,000 i educational debt ? (NOBODY of any age or political party suggested thsi was prudent) We need a little more honesty and grace from all generations on this to find a solution that balances both valid perspective intergenerationally 4. I brought u the trump vote because older people routinely vote republican-2024 brought no surprises there. The shock was younger generations voting republican far more the in the past, ostensibly enough t to make the difference. Younger generations , despite the penchant for boomers to back low tax candidates, had it within the power to elect Hilary. THey failed to turn out for her as they did with obama or even biden. I would only suggest that getting your generation organized -especially females - is going to be far more catalytic than railing against boomers for the reasons you suggest . We are looking at low turnout elections decided by what 60,000 voters in swing districts in .suburbabn Atlanta, Philadelphia, phoenix, Detroit etc for the foreseeable future.
Final point you make some very important points and your frustration is justified. But you should consider if you Palpable anger and intemperate language is advancing your politics. It’s really over the top and a turn off. Be smart and be effective.
Trisha
1. I never used the word hate or indicated it was “all on us” or the sole cause - (who is putting words into whose mouth ? You seem draw inferences from my comments that are not correct. I as suggesting , stipulating younger generations are victimized in thsi regard, that they had agency but failed to exercise in recent elections, that doesn’t exculpate te :dinosaurs” who voted for MAGA, trump etc, but should be borne in mind in critical 2028 general election -in 2 of the last three elections dems have nominated arguably the ONLY person who could have lost to trump -you, I , WE cant affor to make that mistake again. I fear the anger you and other posters express is gogin to result in a nominee that feels good but unelectable re electoral college will hand the Supreme Court over to radical Christian corporate billionaire country club
2. The health analogy is apt. I am an MD and MPH specializing in emergency and internal medicine , so I have standing and experience. Both anecdotes are true and personal i my extended family. Yes you can go to an ED and be triaged for life threatening condition, but once stabilized you may not be admitted and you certainly will receive a bill, and that bill , unpaid will go to collection and ruin your credit.
3. My wife has a career, my 2 daughters do, and all my nieces do.Im hardly a troglodyte . My point was many many women would prefer to not HAVE to work for financial reasons, yet today most have to. That’s a huge change and with day care costs today it bArely moves the needle for family finances. One income use used be enough
4. Separating globalization from capitalism and corporate profit maximization is bizarre. THey are inextricably linked.
To be fair to Harris on 1, if Harris had been the nominee (like if Biden had intentionally been a one term president) from the beginning it would have been quite helpful.
Hard to say if it would have made the difference electorally, of course.
🤘 🤯
Even in the Netherlands it's worth learning Dutch. The main difference is you'll have to be at a much higher level before people stop switching to English with you, and you might have to ask them. But it's just as much a key to being part of things in Rotterdam as in Rome
As European I wonder why there must be s city that fits Americans. The immigrant is the one who should adapt, not the other way round. Our lifestyle and culture are different from country to country, and from city to city, built over thousands of years,there's no need for Americans to "fix" it. I heard so many Americans living here and complaining about Europe, about taxes, about people.... it's boring. Nobody asked them to move here.
I'm frankly astounded by the number of comments in this direction, because I can hardly find an angle in my article that expresses the concept you're pointing out.
Why, indeed, should a European city exist to suit Americans? And conversely, why would Americans even want that, when the whole point for them is precisely to choose a different lifestyle? I can't find the logic in it either way.
My point is to highlight places, often not so well known, that tend to make Americans happy, and to share anecdotes and stories, or more often mistakes they've made in the past, so as to help improve the experience.
In writing this, I noted how often an American's mistake is to assume "they don't know how to run business X in region Y, so let me launch a company." That would actually be a net positive for the local economy if it worked. The fact is that it rarely does, and I warned them about that.
On your last point, that you've heard Americans complaining about Europe while living in Europe, I have nothing to add. All the Americans I know love Europe. Otherwise they'd leave, as some occasionally do, and move back.
Great comment. I’ve read a couple of pieces about Americans retiring to Mexico, and then complaining about Mexican culture.
That's crazy. The same happens here.
You're absolutely correct. Foreign languages can be a challenge for older people. We live in Portugal but fortunately I learned my Portuguese many years earlier when I had lived in Brazil.
This occurs within the USA. Oregon is still the best place I have ever lived. When many of the people from S California moved to Oregon to escape the negatives in the culture of S CA, they worked to bring those very negatives into the culture here. The actions taken by groups of people from S CA have removed many of the positives we had in Oregon. A large number of Americans complain about entitlement while bulldozing the areas that they enter with massive amounts of entitlement of their own.
I joke that we don't need to worry about AI becoming self aware. It will be impossible to find a human being to influence that type of thinking in AI.
Lovely post. Atrocious comment section. My god.
My takeaway was - Are these the fellow expatigrants that I would have to socialize with if I moved overseas?
One of the the things I appreciate about Europeans is that they are generally more polite than Americans. At least in my experience. But the people on this thread are less civilized than my US neighbors.
Excellent article Alejandro. I appreciate that you highlight the social and the financial implications in each city you mention.
Good information. But this American picked Canada. Country-wide 30% discount on everything from a US income perspective. Good tax treaty. Culturally is nearly like being in the US; and I can drive home if I wanted to.
The downsides are the weather, which is terrible if you don’t like the cold in winter, housing and many purchases can be very expensive, but the 30% discount helps a lot.
The way things work will make sense to you; also, you won’t get home sick and can always visit Europe.
I love winter and have thought about Canada. Plus, NJ is an easy drive to get back to friends and family at home.
This is one of the best, no-fluff articles I've read on this subject. Thank you. I like how you bring up the downsides too, though a full treatment of wealth tax and the fact that Roths are a nightmare in countries like NL and ES could be an entire future article for you.
Two cities you didn't mention in this list: Tours (France) and Coimbra (Portugal). I haven't been to Tours but have been to Coimbra twice briefly and it seems like a pleasant university town. Thoughts about those?
Thanks a lot, much appreciated! I know Coimbra well enough to say that it can be a good pick, it's a university city. I don't know any non-Portuguese person, however, who lives there. But it's a lovely city, dense with history!
I have an Italian friend from Naples who did her doctorate at Coimbra university, then ended up relocating there. I've been there twice: it's a hidden gem: way more chill that even Porto but I don't know how well someone would fare there if they don't make an effort to learn Portuguese. I'm partial to university towns which is why I'm intrigued about Tours.
Hey there
Thank you so much for the helpful
Information! This is the first time I’ve seen the list broken down this way.
It’s clear to me from some of the comments that this remains a hot button issue and we have a long way to go in terms of building actual community.
Just visited Stockholm and looked at my wife and said wtf are we doing not living in a place like this? The vibrancy was off the charts.
Swedish culture and unwritten rules can trip you up, you are constantly being judged (like Germany, but friendlier, though there are plenty of conformist cultures - England, Japan - where people are allowed to “let loose” under certain conditions), lots of things are expensive and winter is dark.
Fantastic during the summer months and the people are good fun.
A fascinating article as it shifts the conversation from where Americans struggle to where they actually flourish. I appreciated your emphasis on identifying environments and communities that foster health, purpose, and well-being rather than focusing exclusively on disease and dysfunction. One aspect that particularly resonated with me as a physician-scientist is the recognition that thriving is shaped by far more than income or geography alone. Social connection, economic opportunity, physical safety, education, access to healthcare, and a sense of belonging all contribute to human flourishing. Increasingly, medicine and public health recognize that these social determinants exert effects comparable to many traditional risk factors. Health is not merely an individual attribute but it emerges from the environments in which people live, work, and relate to one another.
For our longevity-focused patients and readers, I would love to add a context that thriving itself is multidimensional. A community may excel economically while struggling with social isolation, whereas another may foster strong social ties and life satisfaction despite fewer material advantages. This highlights an important principle in longevity science: extending lifespan without enhancing purpose, relationships, and quality of life misses much of what makes a long life worth living. Human flourishing cannot be reduced to a single metric.
What I find especially interesting is that many of the factors associated with thriving are remarkably consistent across cultures and generations. Strong relationships, meaningful work, physical activity, access to nature, and opportunities for lifelong learning repeatedly emerge as pillars of well-being. These findings suggest that while technology and economies evolve rapidly, the fundamental ingredients of a fulfilling life remain surprisingly enduring.
Thank you for sharing such an insightful perspective!
This is an excellent guide! Thank you for sharing!
I'm thinking Crete or Cyprus.
This is so relevant! I've spent stretches in both Lyon and Utrecht and they are utterly wonderful places with great culture, great transport, and tremendous beauty. I'd drop everything to live in either place in a heartbeat.
Excellent piece. I’d add Estonia to the list somewhere, but only for the warmest 3 months of the year 🤭 I’m apt to keep doing the Schengen Shuffle myself and be a perpetual renter.
But the threat from Russia is real, no?
Sure, but I don't let Russia's threats against the Baltics keep me out of Estonia any more than I let the USA's threats against Canada keep me out of my home country.
That’s a false dichotomy if I’ve ever seen one. There’s zero chance of the US ever invading Canada. Meanwhile Russia could invade its neighbors any day of this week and we wouldn’t be surprised. I think about it regularly.
As a Canadian whose home was on the redrawn map when Trump threatened to annex part of Canada not long ago, I disagree. Many of us took that seriously, and we’ve seen enough terrible things happen south of our border that we don’t brush his rantings off as just bluster.
That’s my point though, it was clearly all bluster. Trump’s an indisputable asshole but that’s on you if you actually took it seriously. It was never going to happen in reality. People catch TDS and suddenly lose the ability to think objectively.
I understand hating him for being an asshole, what I don’t get is how anyone could have ever thought there was a greater than zero possibility of the US invading Canada. Not saying that’s you, but it’s definitely a significant number of people.
Pretty simple- the US has to pay to defend Canada and Greenland (and the approaches to the US from those areas) because they are unwilling and unable to defend themselves.
Under Trudeau, Canada skimped on military spending and readiness declined greatly.
Trump’s message was simple for anyone who understood the situation and motivation;
1) step up, dramatically so
2) or pay us
3 or join us (which was always just trolling as the last thing Trump would want is another California without the tax revenue).
Carney instead counted on gullible Canadians who took Trump’s bluster literally and capitalized on the perennial undercurrent of hatred for American and Americans.
Now Trump (like most Americans) has gone back to not caring about Canada at all.
Can we not encourage them? The last thing Europe needs is more load brash ignorant racist Trump voting Americans. They can stay and fix their own screwed up country rather than bringing their ignorant religious fundamentalist views into Europe.
It's actually the people who aren't any of those things who are leaving the country, so I don't think you have any concerns there.
Exactly!
The Trump supporters I know consider European countries to be full of communists (because they don’t actually know anything economic and political systems) and cultural elitists and so they would never consider living there. It’s those of us who already travel and are more open-minded and want to learn and experience other ways to live and be within a community that are looking at Europe.
Europe is very welcoming to alternative cultures. Though every country clearly has its own nuances. Culturally Americans tend to be a lot louder than us. That can be challenging but I’m sure most yanks who travel are aware . Culturally as a Brit we get laughed at a lot for how often we say please and thank you. Cultural differences are fabulous when approached with consideration for the host nation. Just please, leave the Trump supporters there! We don’t want that type of attitude across the Atlantic.
I suggest you go on an American trip (maybe you’ve been there before). A lot of World Cup visitors this summer have been pleasantly impressed by the US. There’s a saying: if you want to hate America, listen/watch the news, if you want to love it, go visit it and meet the locals.
My friend the US has a lot to offer but right now it has zero appeal. The level of violence and threat to visitors is too high. You have your own people being shot in the street. Nuns being arrested by ICE. Your border patrol are turning people away at the border for disagreeing with your corrupt government. This doesn’t even take into account th le genocide your administration is complicit in. The impact of your illegal war on our economies. The mistreatment of allies by your administration. The erosion of women’s rights.
A friend was grilled for 30 minutes while his pregnant wife waited as border patrol shouted at my German passport friend because he was born in Madrid. The border patrol kept shouting that he was Mexican and to speak Spanish. The guy is a businessman. He’s never been to Mexico.
Racism is rife. People are being screamed at in the street for looking foreign. Children are getting shot in school, in shopping centres and at places of worship.
It’s not an attractive proposition right now.
I’ve been several times. I will not visit again. I’ll go to Canada or Mexico if I want to visit North America.
Tell us more, oh wise one!
I don't think MAGA is looking to relocate.
Magats and Trumpers don't travel. Let alone to think about moving to a foreign country. Travel is an antidote to ignorance, so definitely not on their list. They also think that ‘murica is the bestest biggest most fantastic place in the world.
I would have thought it was mostly people who dont like Trump et al that are leaving the US. Many are also moving to various parts of Asia, central and South America for a better climate and cheaper cost of living because they can’t afford to live as well in the US and a great many of them are retirees. Perhaps some articles on that might also help people decide. Many are just surviving on Pensions etc and aren’t very wealthy by a long shot.
Had almost nothing to do with Trump.
Generally two categories -
1)WFH digital nomads looking to take advantage of flexibility to explore the world. This is a post-COVID phenomenon.
2)Retirees looking for a different experience or some stereotypical idyll they’ve been sold.
The rest (a minority) are a mixed bag of America or Trump haters, people with limited means looking to retire somewhere cheap (Latam, Asia) and people who have lived and worked overseas for much of their lives and are now retiring.
I’ve lived and worked in Europe and Asia, have foreign-born/dual citizen children and I speak several languages (one of my kids speaks seven) but I am a proud American and religious and somewhat conservative (apolitical though). I also love to travel and like challenging work assignments no matter where they are located (I can make a pleasant life most anywhere). I’ve done business in 30 countries and have managed employees in close to a dozen.
Europe is a very, very conservative place culturally. Generally much more racist,
more conformist, less optimistic, more whingey and less inclusive than the US. Many countries are, relative to the US in my experience. Some Americans may be loud and obnoxious and overly confident/optimistic, and our propensity to talk themselves up can be mind-numbing, but ask yourself whether you’d prefer to live in a culture that talks itself up or one whose greatest pleasure is taking someone else down? Usually I find the braggarts more entertaining than the petty although I’d prefer to avoid both. I thought about staying abroad permanently, but ultimately I did not want my children to spend their whole lives amidst that European mindset. I wanted them to have exposure to American optimism and sensibility while retaining an appreciation for other cultures and countries.
One doesn’t really understand a culture by visiting it nor even living there for a year or two. And nobody abroad really cares about your personal brand or political beliefs- once abroad, you are just an American.
Hey, I'd like to get away from those fools. I no longer feel safe anywhere in the US, just safe-ish in the Boston area, and that's just unaffordable.
Boston is lovely. I’ve been a couple of times and have lovely friends there. I feel awful for all those having to live in the USA who didn’t vote this shit show in. I feel worse for the world that’s having to deal with the fall out.
The UK would welcome you my friend.
My background in terms of immigrant ancestry is all UK -- England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland. I live in Maine, so climate isn't really an issue. I wish it was more affordable for an older starving artist.
I’ve no idea about the immigration requirements. Personally I’d rather 1,000 starving artists than one billionaire
I am genuinely afraid of what will happen this autumn. Being in Maine, I am watching the Platner-Collins matchup for the US Senate seat with great trepidation. Planter is far from perfect personally, but the man has the correct platform on the issues. Collins is getting insane amounts of money from billionaires, largely because she keeps voting for their tax cuts. Our services here in Maine are difficult and getting worse. Rural hospitals close, including labor and delivery units, all the time. The childcare tax credit that would have helped so many struggling families in Maine, as well as across the US, failed because Collins pulled her support from it, and began raking in massive amounts of cash. That’s just a couple of issues. Then there are our forever wars, and Collins is on the wrong side of that, voting for every single blank check for the Pentagon. Platner served, saw things no human being can see and still stay untouched. He came back, struggled, works his way through his problems, and sees how our system fails ordinary people every single day. Get outside Portland and away from the summer people, and life up here is guttingly hard, and getting harder every single week as gasoline and diesel prices skyrocket. The problem is, the Republicans will cheat like crazy to keep Collins in her seat. And they are very good at rigging elections. I’ve started telling people to take their cellphones to the polls and photograph their ballots. We’re going to need the evidence.
So yeah, I want to load up my dog, my brushes, sketchbooks, and dry media, and get the hell out of here.
I’m so sorry you’re having to deal with that! We have a very different system and recently it’s been made even stricter. Wales went as far as making it illegal for politicians to lie to the public. A reaction to the lunacy of the Whitehouse.
I hope the November elections balances things to prevent the insanity getting by worse.
We have beautiful countryside and villages. Away from the cities it’s a slower pace of life. Long walks in the countryside. Everything an artist needs to breathe.
Take care of yourself. Don’t stress over what you can’t change.
Sending hugs. 🤗
Maybe that should be the other way around? I’d rather one impoverished artists than than 1,000 billionaires. Yes that’s better.
Dont worry, Trumpys cant even find Europe on a map, and they would only move to a country that speaks Murikan!
The best thing about Europe is the people 😂🤪
Isn’t it more the Americans that regularly apologize for their country that move to Europe? At least historically that’s been the case. Just as insufferable as die hard trump supporters by the way.
Also, most of the diehard MAGA types don’t even have passports so I’m not sure where you’re getting the idea that trumpers are moving abroad en masse. During their president’s term, no less. Makes zero sense.
wow.
wow.
I pay 53% tax in Portugal. My 401k, my Social Security, all taxed. Rent is over $3000 in the center of Lisbon. It is more expensive to live here for me than the U.S.
Tax don’t reach 53% in Portugal, not to mention its progressive. Rents in central Lisbon are 3000 for maybe an apartment as big as a suburban house in the us, otherwise you find a comfortable 3 bedroom apartment for half that, or a two bedroom with a terrace. Yes, the city is expensive but for those who earn the salaries there because they are low in comparison with the rest of Western Europe and definitely the US
Good analysis. All very true. Spoken as a US retiree happily ensconced not far from Montpellier.